It's harder to shoot porn today than it was back in the old days.

You're dead right. Free has finally started to have an adverse effect on the Adult Internet. Well one that it can clearly see.

I think this is the most telling and greatest point you've ever made.

As Robbie points out this business has never been harder and yet no one has a clue or even wants to have a clue how to fix it. They just keep doing the same thing they've done for the last 15 years. Putting more sites online and loading those sites with more of the same lo quality similar porn that isn't working like it used to.

The saddest thing is I've come up with a possible solution to separate some sites from the rest by investing on what's inside the sites. Give members a better product, give affiliates a better product to sell and give everyone a better ROI.

And everyone disagrees it will work. They want to keep playing the failed game.

That is a very standard contract clause. There is nothing wrong with this contract.

Everything in a general contact like this is held to a "Reasonable Person Standard" The reasonable person standard holds: each person owes a duty to behave as a reasonable person would under the same or similar circumstances. While the specific circumstances of each case will require varying kinds of conduct and degrees of care, the reasonable person standard undergoes no variation itself.


"Timely Maner": Would be looked at by any court under the "Reasonable Person Standard".


Example: you get money wired onto your account for a scene on xxx Date and the average person takes 3 weeks to shoot it and turn it in, the 3 weeks+ 1 week will be deemed reasonable.

6 Months to shoot the scene or never shooting the scene will be deemed unreasonable.




"Form satisfactory to both quality and creativity": This would be judged on a "Reasonable Person Standard" As well.

This pretty much means don't turn in the footage in SD if its agreed that it was so-pose to be HD. Or don't turn in footage way over or under exposed. Don't turn in footage with a shot of your thumb in every shot. too.



These are way bull shit excuses because every time we as content shooters pick up a camera and shoot, these exact contracts that are written into this contract are "implied" on every contract that they are not written in.


"Implied" terms:
A term may either be express or implied. An express term is stated by the parties during negotiation or written in a contractual document. Implied terms are not stated but nevertheless form a provision of the contract.


Man, i can go on and on about this, but this is me keeping it simple and to the point. Sorry about boring you guys with legal mumbo jumbo, but its funny to me when people use what they think is correct law as an excuse to do or not do something.


There is nothing wrong with this contract what so ever. NOTHING! NOTHING! NOTHING!




YUP, YUP AND YUP! I totally agree with Jim Gunn.


I like Paul and respect Paul, but he has shot enough to know this is standard contract shit.

Natan isn't coming after Paul legally for 3K if the scene is piss poor(don't believe it will be piss poor). And I know 3K is like a bar for Nathan. Furthermore it will also be a tax write off for Nathan's business.


Seeing people point out problems when there is no problems is pretty lame. But then again, i have to respect Paul for not taking Nathan's money and not turning in the agreed upon scene.


Then again, I would never expect that from Paul



Lets see what happens...

Do you know he will accept it. If so how?

Then why doesn't he want that clause removed?

This is a no off shoot. Afterwards he will go back to shooting the crap he's already shooting in Mofos. You would reshoot it to keep him buying.

I HAVE TO RE-SHOOT BECAUSE I GAVE MY WORD.

Nice to see you will shoot it 6 scenes for that price. I don't have to.

Just Dave. That's not what it says and it's down to me giving my word that's important.
If my stuff is standard contract shit. Then you lost a ton of money working for peanuts. You and Jim.

You are correct about the "Reasonable Person Standard" which is the most important part of a contract as viewed by the law...regardless of the language used in the contract.

Apparently Markham is as clueless about contracts as he is about almost every other subject he posts about.

not only is Paul the best shooter on gfy, the best website marketer on gfy, and the best content seller on gfy, now he is the best lawyer on gfy.

any real professional (who gave more than a fuck about a standard contract) would pay a lawyer $50 to negotiate the contract rather than arguing about it on go fuck yourself.com like an idiot.

Paul you are an idiot. there is 700+ posts of proof here. any replies will be further proof. stick to what you know.

Another GFY lawyer.

Then maybe I should reword it to say that, sign it and wait for the money to come.

If that's what it means that's what it should say.

It's not about what it means in court, it's about what I give me signature to.

As someone who is so clueless, it's nice to see I made so much more than some of the clued up people here.

That's exactly the kind of post I was hoping for when I asked someone to speak up about the contract clause. It's to the point and simple to read. Thanks for posting that

One would think Paul would now understand what it means and why it's there but he still doesn't and has clearly shown who is being unreasonable

To argue about the contract is so lame after all this.

If you want to make your point and don't want to sign the contract just shoot it and post it here.

You have all bragged about how much money you all earn, so why is this a factor.

I for one find little difference in the quality of Markhams porn and any of the rest.

The only thing this would accomplish is getting yourself the fee you feel you deserve for your work.

It has been pointed out several times why your idea would have little to no effect. Robbie explained it perfectly in post #700. Read it again. Comprehend it. That's all you need to know.

The only failed game being played here is yours.

So I read Robbie's post and most of it is him telling us how rich he is. So I've deleted that BS and will come up with the main points.

Tgps were just the first step.

It doesn't matter what most were, it mattered where the most traffic was. CJ scripts and trading pissed off customers who wanted to see what they might buy. So they went to the sites that didn't piss them off.

Yes he lives in the past wishing Tubes hadn't taken his traffic.

Once you start on the route of giving away free content to get traffic there's no stopping. Because anyone can give away free content. As is clearly proved by the numbers of people giving it away.

That seems to be perfectly legal from the Tubes side. So they are legal.

Which was free porn.

And a hosted gallery with 15 pictures and 4 45 minute clips will get more traffic. And many TGP owners went for the galleries with the most HC content. There's no stopping once you go that route. It just escalates. The only limit is afford-ability.

Then stop trying to sell what can be given away for free. Start realising it's 2011 and the clock goes forward.

And he would know that because?????????????

Well he doesn't so it's guess work.

Today the convenience of a Tube site is killing paysites. The Illegal bit is a red herring he clings to. IF and it's a big if. There was some way that they would and could enforce no pirated content was allowed onto Tubes. Then Manwin would buy up all the cheap porn they could and still have a massive site that would still be better than a paysite. This is in addition to all te sites giving them free porn. The notion that today that the clock can just be turned back is laughable. It's 2011.

And thse paysites could be Tubes charging $1 for a lifetimes membership. Or does Robbie think this dream of a law will stipulate the cost and length of membership.

True. But it started the route of giving away free porn to get 1,000s of surfers so 1-2 would buy. Tubes escalated the game to where it would inevitably go.
I seem to have done a lot better than any other online shooter. The content stores made us more money than they can get.

I would love him to give me a login to his site so I can verify how good his content is. He ignores that request.

If all I could do is shoot good porn then I would be working for Fabian for his lousy money. But as it's very clear I've more skills than that.

I can run a business and have done for longer than most here. As for marketing, well for a guy who can't do it I seem to have done fairly well. As for selling I seem to have sold enough as well. I had the skills to sell our content in many ways, ways that no one here seems to have manged. I also understand marketing porn a lot better than most online porn guys do.

Porn is mostly a repeat buy product. The best selling porn mags ever could hardly hope to get a million sales a month. 1% of the US male population. The secret, not that it was a secret, was to sell to the same people monthly. The same with porn videos/DVDs. Wicked, Private, Evil Angel, etc. Sold to the same guys month after month because these buyers trusted the product to deliver. Very few crap publications lasted. Brand/Title loyalty was everything.

The adult Internet thought they knew a better route. Throw tons of traffic at a poor product that retained for a few months and then replace the guy going out the back door with a guy coming in the front door.

Shame it only worked when the customer had little option. But even then, ratios proved that more traffic was needed to get the same result. Then the "free" concept became a real threat. Tubes didn't kill or hurt the business. The cost of giving away a scene to 10,000s of surfers to get 1 sign up on a dating site did that.

I explain marketing porn here in more depth. http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17996050&postcount=33

The reaction from the paysite is industry was what?

Still waiting for it apart from the moaning. There has been no reaction. For a few sites that can afford it there is a better way. To up the quality of the members area to grab more of the dwindling number of customers left. It's not a solution for many. As few can afford it.

Many are moaning that it was easier 5 years ago. They live in the past. It's 2011 and the time is now to stop and think of how to change to compete with Tubes. Not moan that it's not like it used to be.

That's my job on GFY.

The cost of hosting, BW and speed is killing the online porn business and nothing else.

If the most a site could afford to put out as promotion was something like these.

Paul Markham Teens.





Online porn would be worth billions of dollars, and not 1 or 2, more like $20 billion to $30 billion.

Sadly the cost of giving it away for free has hurt this business. And will continue to hurt this business. Even Manwin will get hurt. Because free is so cheap to give away free to 100,000s when a sale on anything, will pay for it. And that anything, won't be a porn paysite. Eventually not even the very best. Eventually even micro niches may get hit. Someone will start a Fetish Tube site, if it's not already done. Probably is.

And all the marketing expertise in the world isn't going to change it.

We done goofed yet?

I'm actually embarrassed for you. This is the first time Ive actually felt sorry for you. You pretty much had no credibility at all here, the VERY little you had has gone

Oh and when you keep putting after every post it makes you look desperate, very desperate to make someone think your not just a disillusioned old "never been"

this thread is just sad now. send it to the glue factory or take it behind the woodshed and put it out of it's misery.

Paul, don't you realize that the only thing that would be better than you delivering a great shoot is to deliver a horrible shoot, lol? Manwin won't be looking for you to re-shoot any scenes. This is all a goof and an experiment anyway. As a general rule, producers in the biz who don't do a good job don't get asked to do re-shoots by companies hiring them, they just don't get hired again. The language in the contract about delivery & timeliness is basically just to prevent a producer from taking the studio's money, delivering nothing at all and simply disappearing. By the way, I wouldn't shoot six shoots for the price of one, silly. The point was that I could have shot and delivered similar content with multiple models and got paid the full rate for each shoot several times in the time that this discussion has taken so far.