Explain to me why in mainstream affiliate land its ok to ........

I do not promote anyone who buys traffic from zango, nor will I.

...and yes, I will not promote anyone who used to buy traffic from zango.

I will not trade traffic with anyone who has ads on their sites that promote a company that has ever been involved with zango.

consider the source. adtech? lol

Not only that, international traffic (non-us) is shaved right off to other affiliate programs where affiliates don't get credit, they put exit consoles where you get no credit, there's lots of traffic leaks (email entries, etc.) and worst of all, this is very much accepted as the norm in mainstream. In adult, your program would be shut down within a week for doing any of this, and its all done on tons of programs and accepted among webmasters.
WG

I'd have to say the majority don't understand how it works. For whatever reason there is a host of things mainstream gets away with but i have to chalk it up to ignorant affiliates. Many here didn't understand and a good number still don't.

And just because you are told this is the norm and hense, should be acceptable it just sounds like someone is trying to justify the use of it for themselves.

Adult marketing, sales, and other such things have always been years and years behind the rest. I am not exactly sure why.. I guess it has something to do with the product being sold, how many large corporations won't touch it or something similiar.

But anyway, its still not ok at all. I don't thinkt hey mess with mainstream as much as they do adult though, it seams easier to pick on people in the adult industry.

we must have more of a clue how things work.

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Adware has been rampant in mainstream for years and there are a lot more adware in mainstream than in porn for the simple reason that many don't allow adult content. Besides in porn you don't have rebate software stealing from you where you have a lot of those in mainstream.

But to say it's the norm and everybody accepts it? Where the hell did you get that from????

Zango has a booth at nearly all industry tradeshows, does that mean that they're ok to deal with? HARDLY! If you don't understand how they work they'll feed you the biggest load of bullshit you'll ever hear in your life and make their program sound like the best thing on earth since sliced bread. You'll come back thinking you just met the internet God when in reality you came face to face with the devil.

Do you really think these scumbags tell the world that they help/facilitate, hell call it what you want, to overwrite cookies and steal from programs and other affiliates? Many networks love adware in mainstream. They collect commissions on sales that should never be commissionable in the first place. They don't tell merchants the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth about adware. Merchants are told that adware will make them more money by making more sales.

WRONG!

Anyone with any knowledge of how adware truly works knows this.

The norm? I think not! Many mainstream affiliates only associate themselves with networks and/or merchants known not to allow adware. Many are also very proactive for this stuff and use expert services to monitor their programs on a regular basis.

Whoever told you it was the norm in mainstream is pulling your leg... big time!

Missie

Adult marketing is NOT behind the times. Adult marketing has paved the way for mainstream advertisers. I would take a wild guess, and say, if mainstream advertising is doing it, you'll find it has been done in adult allready.

most just don't care. money flows easy in mainstream. traffic isn't tight like it is in adult. mainstream guys are about making money, not making friends. in adult traffic is so tight you have to make friends. you have to play nice.

I've only dabbled in mainstream and find them truly fucked up. Piss poor stats, only using cookies to track sales etc, changing links whenever they feel like it. I think that in mainstream, affiliates are an "add on", an afterthought whereas in this business they're far more integrated into the sales process.

I came to adult because mainstream is to cut throat...

cut throat in mainstream

i think that generally we are more educated than mainstream is... further "mainstream" has no community... no echo
plus for a lot of stuff there is no competition... if you wanna promote ebay you stick to their shit or you dont promote them

You are completely clueless. Its the exact opposite of what you said, adult marketing has always been at the forefront of new marketing/advertising ideas and methods. When I was heavily involved in mainstream in 97-2000, I was constantly coming across new successful marketing ideas and then subsequently learned that it was already being done in adult.

In regards to the original post, I've seen lately on some mainstream boards that there is also a groundswell of opposition against such programs as Zango. However, I get the overall feeling listening to mainstream affiliates that they really don't understand how some of the programs work in regards to stealing their traffic.

i wouldnt say its really accepted in mainstream either.

If they market it for what it is any fool can see its a bum deal , so they way they market this is like its "competition traffic" they are taking.. so its easy to see how people get fooled into thinking its a "good deal"

5% comm in mainstream turned me off (notwithstanding the mortgage, credit card, etc., that payout more). Plus, I only had passion for passion. heh.

I can say that in the mainstream world ..The anti-Spyware sentiment is growing very quickly.

The problem in the end is a lack of education for most...Many affiliates/publishers will not tolerate and knowingly use a network using questionable techniques.

Also, the other issue with large networks with hundreds of offers ...the offers are not owned by the network and just managed (pushed), thus what really goes on is never known. This is one of the reasons LeadFlash.com has only its own owned offers.

In the end, I'd like to believe that lack of education is the culprit over just total ignorance.

-=Chipmunk=-

maybe i phrased my response to the panelist wrong. are there other b2b traffic conventions besides adtech, which to me seems like a harboring ground for shady adware and spyware companies that justify each other and tell each other they're okies? no thanks, i'll keep pursuing my interests outside adult that don't involve those things. i guess the reason maybe no one else continued on what i started was because it was the making a name for yourself panel and not a traffic panel, who knows. no biggie. my poisition remains the same.

one thing that i don't want people to assume is that i am numb to evolution. of course i understand technology and the advancement of the webs marketing playing field and the tools and techniques that are pushing its advancement. i'm merely fishing for answers from those that know this element best as to the acceptance of these marketing tactics. we all know there are more than 6 degrees of separation from adult to mainstream. i guess if you want to understand something you have to go see it for yourself.

Huh ???

Behind ??

I don't think so. The adult internet has led the way for the mainstream internet. Most methodologies being used in the mainstream internet marketing were first used and shaken out by the adult internet.

The reason that mainstream puts up with that is because there are a lot more clueless folks marketing mainstream than there are in adult. The adult webmaster community tends to be more cohesive and supportive than the mainstream webmaster community and because it is a smaller community it is much more likely that deceptive practices will be outed much more quickly.

I´m pretty sure it´s not accepted in mainstream.
Most mainstream webmasters are clueless about it but once they find out they do not accept it.In fact, I´ve seen many programs that will kick any affiliate overwriting cookies.

no big mainstream sites support adware really of any kind once they realise its adware, the problem is theres alot more "bulk" ad services in mainsream, these work kinda like click laundering.. they do serve a purpose but theres clean ones and dirty ones.. much like zango.. they both buy and sell traffic through these ways so its not all coming from adware. they just make 3 companies .. broker seller and buyer, then "pad" the traffic with their crap.

another big difference is the line isnt so clear of adware/legit soft in mainstream

icq has ads so is it adware ? with some quick talking zango can market their products using keywords like "icq like advertising" to potential clients and they see no problem with it.

reality is though i highly doubt anyone with zango would use its software if they understood what they were getting in to. this is illegal and they will eventually be prosecuted ( again )

I hope you meant to type "ahead" and not "behind", for fucks sake even Thomas Edison invented the light bulb so he could look at his porn magazine late at night