EPASSPORTE: Why provide webmaster payouts for a toolbar company?

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  • RawAlex
    So Fucking Banned
    • Oct 2003
    • 9465
    #1

    EPASSPORTE: Why provide webmaster payouts for a toolbar company?

    http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=717895

    The company is videoscash.com - epass payouts.

    They install Zlob - and contrary to the information on their website, they install much of it BEFORE asking permission, and if you say no, there is a still a ton of stuff on your system including a very effective rootkit.

    So, Epass people, why are you helping them and keeping them as a client?
    Tags: None
    • tony299
      lurker
      • Aug 2002
      • 57021
      #2
      you havent realized we are in the whore industry lol

        Comment

        • RawAlex
          So Fucking Banned
          • Oct 2003
          • 9465
          #3
          whore yes... but in the end, these people are stealing my sales, your sales, and everyone elses sales, traffic, etc.

          In the end, this is the sort of thing that ruins the adult affiliate business model.

            Comment

            • Ray@TastyDollars
              www.TastyDollars.com
              • May 2002
              • 6797
              #4
              what we spoke about yesturday are all Videoscash installs?

                Comment

                • RawAlex
                  So Fucking Banned
                  • Oct 2003
                  • 9465
                  #5
                  Yup... it all tracks back to them.

                    Comment

                    • Ray@TastyDollars
                      www.TastyDollars.com
                      • May 2002
                      • 6797
                      #6
                      Originally posted by RawAlex
                      Yup... it all tracks back to them.
                      I guess it time to make a video huh? Hit me up on Monday

                        Comment

                        • DamageX
                          Marketing & Strategy
                          • Jun 2001
                          • 14293
                          #7
                          Originally posted by RawAlex
                          whore yes... but in the end, these people are stealing my sales, your sales, and everyone elses sales, traffic, etc.
                          Do you HONESTLY think Epassporte cares about who steals what in this industry, as long as everyone uses their service?
                          Whitehat is for chumps

                          If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

                            Comment

                            • vvq
                              Confirmed User
                              • Feb 2004
                              • 2732
                              #8
                              see that guy that ranks higher than you in google? he's stealing your sales. see those people advertising on search engines with adwords? they're stealing your sales. see that gallery listed higher than you on the hun? he's stealing your sales.

                              business isn't always fair. adapt.

                              SQUIRTING - LESBIAN SPANKING - TITTY FUCKING - WET PANTIES - MORE
                              We offer free hosting, your own designer (works for free), and unsaturated content for gallery and free site submitters. Just contact me! E-mail: [email protected]

                                Comment

                                • DamageX
                                  Marketing & Strategy
                                  • Jun 2001
                                  • 14293
                                  #9
                                  Originally posted by vvq
                                  see that guy that ranks higher than you in google? he's stealing your sales. see those people advertising on search engines with adwords? they're stealing your sales. see that gallery listed higher than you on the hun? he's stealing your sales.

                                  business isn't always fair. adapt.
                                  This is more like we delivering the goods and someone else getting to charge the customer though.
                                  Whitehat is for chumps

                                  If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

                                    Comment

                                    • RawAlex
                                      So Fucking Banned
                                      • Oct 2003
                                      • 9465
                                      #10
                                      Originally posted by vvq
                                      see that guy that ranks higher than you in google? he's stealing your sales. see those people advertising on search engines with adwords? they're stealing your sales. see that gallery listed higher than you on the hun? he's stealing your sales.

                                      business isn't always fair. adapt.
                                      i will compete with anyone on a reasonable playing field. I am not the strongest, I don't have the most traffic, and I don't have mad skillz... but when someone is "winning" by tricking people into installed malware and then profiting from it, not only did they beat me once, but they will beat me again every day EVEN IF I DO BETTER THAN THEY DO.

                                      They killed the ref, took the fans hostage, and are expecting me to haul the mail for them.

                                      Damagex: I expect Epassporte to be like any other company - not wanting to be involved with companies that distribute malware.

                                        Comment

                                        • Klen
                                          • Aug 2006
                                          • 32234
                                          #11
                                          A lot of spyware companies use epassporte for payment.

                                            Comment

                                            • DamageX
                                              Marketing & Strategy
                                              • Jun 2001
                                              • 14293
                                              #12
                                              Originally posted by RawAlex
                                              Damagex: I expect Epassporte to be like any other company - not wanting to be involved with companies that distribute malware.
                                              You mean like AFF and SexSearch?
                                              Whitehat is for chumps

                                              If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

                                                Comment

                                                • TampaToker
                                                  Confirmed User
                                                  • May 2006
                                                  • 5828
                                                  #13
                                                  Originally posted by vvq
                                                  see that guy that ranks higher than you in google? he's stealing your sales. see those people advertising on search engines with adwords? they're stealing your sales. see that gallery listed higher than you on the hun? he's stealing your sales.

                                                  business isn't always fair. adapt.
                                                  Good i like that attitude you can now be my test rat
                                                  Icq 247-742-205

                                                    Comment

                                                    • crockett
                                                      in a van by the river
                                                      • May 2003
                                                      • 76818
                                                      #14
                                                      Another Question.. Why is Epassporte allowing it's use on ESTDomains.com probably the most used host for cheaters. In fact I think a few people have linked estdomain directly to many of the cheats and scammers in this industry.. Yet they have use of epassporte for payment for their services.
                                                      In November, you can vote for America's next president or its first dictator.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • V_RocKs
                                                          Damn Right I Kiss Ass!
                                                          • Nov 2003
                                                          • 32458
                                                          #15
                                                          ESTDomains.com should have their shit canned.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • vvq
                                                              Confirmed User
                                                              • Feb 2004
                                                              • 2732
                                                              #16
                                                              Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                              i will compete with anyone on a reasonable playing field. I am not the strongest, I don't have the most traffic, and I don't have mad skillz... but when someone is "winning" by tricking people into installed malware and then profiting from it, not only did they beat me once, but they will beat me again every day EVEN IF I DO BETTER THAN THEY DO.

                                                              They killed the ref, took the fans hostage, and are expecting me to haul the mail for them.

                                                              Damagex: I expect Epassporte to be like any other company - not wanting to be involved with companies that distribute malware.
                                                              i don't support spyware, but you're living in a dream world if you think business is all about being fair. all spyware does is up the tehnical prowess needed to compete. from an ethical standpoint, no i don't like it, but whining solves nothing. contrary to what most people think around here business doesn't revolve around board drama. it revolves around $$$.

                                                              if these guys are breaking the law, take them to court. posting on GFY really isn't going to stop anything. it's great that you want your voice to be heard on the subject, but if you really care about your traffic you'd take legal action. and if you can't take legal action, tough. that's how the world operates.

                                                              again, i don't personally support spyware or have anything to do with it. i'm just voicing my opinion on why bitching on the forums is the wrong way to go about stopping it.

                                                              in the end everyone involved is just trying to make a buck. do you think the customer cares who his money goes to when he joins Adult Friend Finder?

                                                              SQUIRTING - LESBIAN SPANKING - TITTY FUCKING - WET PANTIES - MORE
                                                              We offer free hosting, your own designer (works for free), and unsaturated content for gallery and free site submitters. Just contact me! E-mail: [email protected]

                                                                Comment

                                                                • RawAlex
                                                                  So Fucking Banned
                                                                  • Oct 2003
                                                                  • 9465
                                                                  #17
                                                                  vvg, I am not asking for "fair". Nothing in life is fair, certainly not this business.

                                                                  Legality? Well, unless I am going to try to find some international tribunal to handle it, I really doubt that I can do much to take legal action against scammers in Russia and the Czech Republic. Obviously, the "legal channels" angle is totally not going to work out any time soon. These guys have shown to be rather less than interested in the law, anyway.

                                                                  My point is that the legit side of the adult industry, the part that doesn't support toolbars, hacks, viruses, and malware shouldn't have anything to do with those that do. Don't buy the traffic, don't provide services, and don't knowingly link to the shit. Why the fuck should scammers have the same tools that I do. In your own words, business ain't fair. Fuck them, let's make it less fair FOR THEM.

                                                                  in the end everyone involved is just trying to make a buck. do you think the customer cares who his money goes to when he joins Adult Friend Finder?
                                                                  This is where your argument falls down. This is like saying the crack dealer on your street corner is okay, because, well, he is just trying to make a buck.

                                                                  The customer surely cares when his computer is so fucked over he can't use it for anything. That very likely means one more person that will never surf for porn again... one less customer for us.

                                                                  I am totally stunned that you can't see cause and effect here.

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • vvq
                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                      • Feb 2004
                                                                      • 2732
                                                                      #18
                                                                      Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                      vvg, I am not asking for "fair". Nothing in life is fair, certainly not this business.

                                                                      Legality? Well, unless I am going to try to find some international tribunal to handle it, I really doubt that I can do much to take legal action against scammers in Russia and the Czech Republic. Obviously, the "legal channels" angle is totally not going to work out any time soon. These guys have shown to be rather less than interested in the law, anyway.
                                                                      Exactly. So learn to protect your assets. It's no different than the TGP guys running scripts to make sure people aren't redirecting or putting hsit on galleries after they're listed. You have to take action to protect your traffic. I don't consider posting on the boards taking action. That's just me though I guess.

                                                                      My point is that the legit side of the adult industry, the part that doesn't support toolbars, hacks, viruses, and malware shouldn't have anything to do with those that do. Don't buy the traffic, don't provide services, and don't knowingly link to the shit. Why the fuck should scammers have the same tools that I do. In your own words, business ain't fair. Fuck them, let's make it less fair FOR THEM.
                                                                      While it might be considered scamming to you, toolbar/install traffic is considered perfectly legit by other people. I'm pretty sure Zango operates from the United States don't they? We don't like it when banks make ethical decisions to close personal bank accounts because we work in porn, why should Epassporte have to make an ethical decision? They're a service provider. You don't sue gun makers when someone shoots someone.

                                                                      This is where your argument falls down. This is like saying the crack dealer on your street corner is okay, because, well, he is just trying to make a buck.
                                                                      No, I'm saying your opinion is biased because you're losing money. You believe Zango and all these other companies are bad because you're losing money to them. That's a fact. You're not on some noble quest to make the Internet a better place. Money is your motivation, same thing as Zango, same thing as anyone in this business.

                                                                      The customer surely cares when his computer is so fucked over he can't use it for anything. That very likely means one more person that will never surf for porn again... one less customer for us.
                                                                      The customer cares so much that rather than cleaning up all the nasty evil spyware on his computer, he's pulling out his credit card and joining adult friend finder? Clearly Zango is of more concern to affiliates than customers.

                                                                      I am totally stunned that you can't see cause and effect here.
                                                                      I see the damage caused by all the illegal shit turning computers into zombies for spam botnets and all the randsomware bullshit. Overwriting affiliate codes isn't a threat to consumers.

                                                                      Are you boycotting WalMart? Are you out there picketing for the cause? Aren't they one of Zangos biggest clients?

                                                                      anyway, fuck spyware. i don't support it. i do NOT want to be seen as supporter of this shit. i'm just not fighting trends. i'd rather protect my traffic and let everyone else waste time crying. seems like the smart thing to do. spyware or not, the strong will survive. every now and then you need stuff like this to happen to thin out the herd.

                                                                      SQUIRTING - LESBIAN SPANKING - TITTY FUCKING - WET PANTIES - MORE
                                                                      We offer free hosting, your own designer (works for free), and unsaturated content for gallery and free site submitters. Just contact me! E-mail: [email protected]

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • RawAlex
                                                                          So Fucking Banned
                                                                          • Oct 2003
                                                                          • 9465
                                                                          #19
                                                                          vvg, actually, Zango paid a 3 million dollar settlement to the FTC for using misleading methods for installing their product...

                                                                          I see the damage caused by all the illegal shit turning computers into zombies for spam botnets and all the randsomware bullshit. Overwriting affiliate codes isn't a threat to consumers.
                                                                          That is what this is all about. These guys aren't bothering to overwrite cookies, that is kids games. They are fucking off with the traffic and reselling it as PPC, running botnets on the computers, and generally fucking people over solid. This isn't just a naughty toolbar - they are fucking people's computers over solid.

                                                                          If it was only a toolbar, it wouldn't be very serious. Rootkits are fucking serious business.

                                                                          I suggest you investigate further before you lump it all in one pile. Look around for "Zlob" or "Zlob8".

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • baddog
                                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                                              • Apr 2001
                                                                              • 107089
                                                                              #20
                                                                              did you start this thread with the idea that they would actually respond?

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • themonk
                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                  • May 2006
                                                                                  • 6511
                                                                                  #21
                                                                                  srry i dont really care
                                                                                  175$ Per Sale - The Best Sponsor

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • RawAlex
                                                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                                                      • Oct 2003
                                                                                      • 9465
                                                                                      #22
                                                                                      Originally posted by baddog
                                                                                      did you start this thread with the idea that they would actually respond?
                                                                                      Well, I figure that Michael might come wandering through... plus I am sure some of their friends will mention such a thread.

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • DamageX
                                                                                          Marketing & Strategy
                                                                                          • Jun 2001
                                                                                          • 14293
                                                                                          #23
                                                                                          Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                          Well, I figure that Michael might come wandering through... plus I am sure some of their friends will mention such a thread.
                                                                                          Michael will not address this, this is a management issue and he's not management. The management is probably on holiday in Europe and would probably not address it regardless, since he has publically stated that he's decided to make it a policy that epassporte will not comment on board threads.
                                                                                          Whitehat is for chumps

                                                                                          If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • RawAlex
                                                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                                                              • Oct 2003
                                                                                              • 9465
                                                                                              #24
                                                                                              Originally posted by DamageX
                                                                                              Michael will not address this, this is a management issue and he's not management. The management is probably on holiday in Europe and would probably not address it regardless, since he has publically stated that he's decided to make it a policy that epassporte will not comment on board threads.
                                                                                              Okay then, fuck it. let the thieves win.

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • DamageX
                                                                                                  Marketing & Strategy
                                                                                                  • Jun 2001
                                                                                                  • 14293
                                                                                                  #25
                                                                                                  Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                  Okay then, fuck it. let the thieves win.
                                                                                                  Actually, that wasn't my point. Just because epass won't address this doesn't mean that we should let the thieves win. There's more than one way to skin a thief.
                                                                                                  Whitehat is for chumps

                                                                                                  If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                    • swampthing
                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                      • Mar 2007
                                                                                                      • 570
                                                                                                      #26
                                                                                                      Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                      whore yes... but in the end, these people are stealing my sales, your sales, and everyone elses sales, traffic, etc.

                                                                                                      In the end, this is the sort of thing that ruins the adult affiliate business model.
                                                                                                      in my opinion, they dont care about ruining adult business model. They also take money from gambling sites. They also like to cancel accounts on people and see how far they will go to get there money back.

                                                                                                      keep supporting epass you sheep.

                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                        • stickyfingerz
                                                                                                          Doin fine
                                                                                                          • Oct 2005
                                                                                                          • 24984
                                                                                                          #27
                                                                                                          Im sorry but I dont really want a company like epassporte (not there is anything wrong with them I like epass Im just saying) deciding on what is ethical and banning someone due to it.

                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                            • RawAlex
                                                                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                              • Oct 2003
                                                                                                              • 9465
                                                                                                              #28
                                                                                                              Originally posted by stickyfingerz
                                                                                                              Im sorry but I dont really want a company like epassporte (not there is anything wrong with them I like epass Im just saying) deciding on what is ethical and banning someone due to it.
                                                                                                              The only question of ethics is "do we support people infecting computers with rootkits and breaching their security, or don't we?"

                                                                                                              That isn't a huge ethical deal.

                                                                                                              Epass has the right to refuse business to anyone. Why should they be the payment system of choice of a bunch of malware installing assholes? (assholes enough to actually threaten me).

                                                                                                              It's not important anyway. None of this matters.

                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                • baddog
                                                                                                                  So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                  • Apr 2001
                                                                                                                  • 107089
                                                                                                                  #29
                                                                                                                  Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                  Well, I figure that Michael might come wandering through... plus I am sure some of their friends will mention such a thread.
                                                                                                                  Why would he address this? Not his job.

                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                    • DamageX
                                                                                                                      Marketing & Strategy
                                                                                                                      • Jun 2001
                                                                                                                      • 14293
                                                                                                                      #30
                                                                                                                      Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                      Epass has the right to refuse business to anyone. Why should they be the payment system of choice of a bunch of malware installing assholes?
                                                                                                                      Because it makes epass money and they don't give a flying fuck about us webmasters.
                                                                                                                      Whitehat is for chumps

                                                                                                                      If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                        • BlackCrayon
                                                                                                                          Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                                          • Jun 2003
                                                                                                                          • 19634
                                                                                                                          #31
                                                                                                                          Originally posted by vvq
                                                                                                                          see that guy that ranks higher than you in google? he's stealing your sales. see those people advertising on search engines with adwords? they're stealing your sales. see that gallery listed higher than you on the hun? he's stealing your sales.

                                                                                                                          business isn't always fair. adapt.
                                                                                                                          what a terrible comparison. the guy who is higher than me on google isn't using my website to pop ads. by your logic i guess gallery cheaters have a place in our business just like virus installers and others. they are just further ahead of the game than the rest of us? give me a break.
                                                                                                                          Last edited by BlackCrayon; 03-25-2007, 05:50 PM.
                                                                                                                          you don't know you're wearing a leash if you sit by the peg all day..

                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                            • BlackCrayon
                                                                                                                              Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                                              • Jun 2003
                                                                                                                              • 19634
                                                                                                                              #32
                                                                                                                              Originally posted by vvq
                                                                                                                              i don't support spyware, but you're living in a dream world if you think business is all about being fair. all spyware does is up the tehnical prowess needed to compete. from an ethical standpoint, no i don't like it, but whining solves nothing. contrary to what most people think around here business doesn't revolve around board drama. it revolves around $$$.

                                                                                                                              if these guys are breaking the law, take them to court. posting on GFY really isn't going to stop anything. it's great that you want your voice to be heard on the subject, but if you really care about your traffic you'd take legal action. and if you can't take legal action, tough. that's how the world operates.

                                                                                                                              again, i don't personally support spyware or have anything to do with it. i'm just voicing my opinion on why bitching on the forums is the wrong way to go about stopping it.

                                                                                                                              in the end everyone involved is just trying to make a buck. do you think the customer cares who his money goes to when he joins Adult Friend Finder?
                                                                                                                              more stupidty! the law is useless when it comes to technology. they are so far behind and usually don't even understand the things they pass laws against. if spyware didn't rely on my traffic, my websites and my keywords to make their money, i wouldn't have anything to complain about.
                                                                                                                              you don't know you're wearing a leash if you sit by the peg all day..

                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                • fris
                                                                                                                                  I have to go potty
                                                                                                                                  • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                                  • 55824
                                                                                                                                  #33
                                                                                                                                  oh the horrors of videoscash, wont trade with anyone who promotes them
                                                                                                                                  Since 1999: 69 Adult Industry awards for Best Hosting Company and professional excellence.


                                                                                                                                  My Newest Theme

                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                    • RawAlex
                                                                                                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                      • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                      • 9465
                                                                                                                                      #34
                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by baddog
                                                                                                                                      Why would he address this? Not his job.
                                                                                                                                      Umm, he works there. He might point it out to someone over there that gives a flying fuck (more than most people around here give, apparently).

                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                        • jayeff
                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                          • May 2001
                                                                                                                                          • 2944
                                                                                                                                          #35
                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by vvq
                                                                                                                                          see that guy that ranks higher than you in google? he's stealing your sales. see those people advertising on search engines with adwords? they're stealing your sales. see that gallery listed higher than you on the hun? he's stealing your sales.

                                                                                                                                          business isn't always fair. adapt.
                                                                                                                                          If that really is your view and you aren't just making a juvenile attempt at being "cool", I suggest you find another occupation. You clearly don't have a clue.

                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                            • baddog
                                                                                                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                              • Apr 2001
                                                                                                                                              • 107089
                                                                                                                                              #36
                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                              Umm, he works there. He might point it out to someone over there that gives a flying fuck (more than most people around here give, apparently).
                                                                                                                                              That is like some asking guy on the assembly line why GM doesn't invest more money on developing a car that runs on water.

                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                • RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                  So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                  • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                                  • 9465
                                                                                                                                                  #37
                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by baddog
                                                                                                                                                  That is like some asking guy on the assembly line why GM doesn't invest more money on developing a car that runs on water.
                                                                                                                                                  Not in the slightest. I am not asking Michael himself to do anything - except perhaps mention it to people who do have the power.

                                                                                                                                                  Sort of like asking a board member of GM to ask the CEO why they don't build more electric cars.

                                                                                                                                                  Why do I start to think you make money on toolbar installs?

                                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                                    • vvq
                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                      • Feb 2004
                                                                                                                                                      • 2732
                                                                                                                                                      #38
                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                      vvg, actually, Zango paid a 3 million dollar settlement to the FTC for using misleading methods for installing their product...



                                                                                                                                                      That is what this is all about. These guys aren't bothering to overwrite cookies, that is kids games. They are fucking off with the traffic and reselling it as PPC, running botnets on the computers, and generally fucking people over solid. This isn't just a naughty toolbar - they are fucking people's computers over solid.

                                                                                                                                                      If it was only a toolbar, it wouldn't be very serious. Rootkits are fucking serious business.

                                                                                                                                                      I suggest you investigate further before you lump it all in one pile. Look around for "Zlob" or "Zlob8".
                                                                                                                                                      ok. but is targeting service providers and sponsors really going to stop this? your war is with the wrong people. there is always going to be someone taking the installs. maybe you should start something to create awareness with consumers. it's their computer. it's honestly their responsability to make sure it's not being turned into a zombie machine. the only reason anyone here is attempting to interject themselves into the equation is because you're losing money. while i agree the people doing that shit need to be stopped, realistically it probably won't ever happen.

                                                                                                                                                      we're in the porn business. morals and ethics aren't exactly high up on our list. but the second someone does something you're morally against it's time to lay down the law and make heads roll? please please. spyware isn't going to be stopped there is too much money in it. it's like trying to stop all the free content going around. it can't be done at this point.

                                                                                                                                                      i'm not saying get into the spyware game and start doing illegal shit. i'm saying stop beating a dead horse. deal with it. the problem is with a bunch of morons that let their boxes get compromised. you're not gonna solve that problem by posting about shit on GFY.

                                                                                                                                                      SQUIRTING - LESBIAN SPANKING - TITTY FUCKING - WET PANTIES - MORE
                                                                                                                                                      We offer free hosting, your own designer (works for free), and unsaturated content for gallery and free site submitters. Just contact me! E-mail: [email protected]

                                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                                        • RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                          So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                          • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                                          • 9465
                                                                                                                                                          #39
                                                                                                                                                          vvg, if it was a question of morals, I would debate you all day on the good and the bad. The reality is that this isn't a moral issue like "do we show pink on page 1 or not" but "do we allow people who breach computer security to make money from the same sources we use"?

                                                                                                                                                          I'm dealing with it the way I know how - working to remove the easy money and easy hosting that these assholes use to break into end users computers, and to rewards "webmasters" who think it is a great idea to "sell installs" to a sponsor.

                                                                                                                                                          I can do that, or I can call each internet user individually and talk to them for 20 minutes each about how not to allow this shit to get into their computer.

                                                                                                                                                          I figure my route will have better results at least in the short run.

                                                                                                                                                          If you think it is a dead horse, why not just go play in another thread instead? To some of us, this is still an important issue (but I suspect it isn't an issue in the traffic business, because you are likely buying traffic from them, one click removed).

                                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                                            • vvq
                                                                                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                              • Feb 2004
                                                                                                                                                              • 2732
                                                                                                                                                              #40
                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                              If you think it is a dead horse, why not just go play in another thread instead? To some of us, this is still an important issue (but I suspect it isn't an issue in the traffic business, because you are likely buying traffic from them, one click removed).
                                                                                                                                                              i don't touch scum traffic. like i said. go boycott walmart. money motivates your decision on this issue. nothing else.

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                                                                                                                                                                • RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                  So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                  • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                                                  • 9465
                                                                                                                                                                  #41
                                                                                                                                                                  Yes, money motivates my decision on this issue. Someone steals my money, I am motivated to get rid of them. Abusing potential customers, violating the security of their systems, and installing spyware, malware, zombies, and other horseshit on their machines steals my money. Damn fucking right I am motivated.

                                                                                                                                                                  I will assure you that if you buy traffic from TGPs, you are almost certainly buying toolbar traffic and helping to support rootkit installers. it is unavoidable. Some of the largest trading sites on the net are fronts for it. I suspect that your arrogance about the subject is as much motivated by your own bottom line.

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                                                                                                                                                                    • vvq
                                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                      • Feb 2004
                                                                                                                                                                      • 2732
                                                                                                                                                                      #42
                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                      Yes, money motivates my decision on this issue. Someone steals my money, I am motivated to get rid of them. Abusing potential customers, violating the security of their systems, and installing spyware, malware, zombies, and other horseshit on their machines steals my money. Damn fucking right I am motivated.

                                                                                                                                                                      I will assure you that if you buy traffic from TGPs, you are almost certainly buying toolbar traffic and helping to support rootkit installers. it is unavoidable. Some of the largest trading sites on the net are fronts for it. I suspect that your arrogance about the subject is as much motivated by your own bottom line.
                                                                                                                                                                      Listen. If you shop at WalMart you support Zango. I just picked up a fucking bottle of lemonade and the Snakes on a Plane DVD when i was out earlier. Please don't crucify me at the stake for indirectly supporting botnets when I do my shopping at WalMart.

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                                                                                                                                                                        • RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                          So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                          • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                                                          • 9465
                                                                                                                                                                          #43
                                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by vvq
                                                                                                                                                                          Listen. If you shop at WalMart you support Zango. I just picked up a fucking bottle of lemonade and the Snakes on a Plane DVD when i was out earlier. Please don't crucify me at the stake for indirectly supporting botnets when I do my shopping at WalMart.

                                                                                                                                                                          Congrats, you no longer make an ounce of sense.

                                                                                                                                                                          Perhaps you should have picked up a more healthy beverage?

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                                                                                                                                                                            • vvq
                                                                                                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                              • Feb 2004
                                                                                                                                                                              • 2732
                                                                                                                                                                              #44
                                                                                                                                                                              Zango Blacklist

                                                                                                                                                                              Worst Offenders

                                                                                                                                                                              1. AdultFriendFinder.com
                                                                                                                                                                              2. theHomeMarketPlace.com
                                                                                                                                                                              3. SexSearch.com
                                                                                                                                                                              4. BeyondTrade.net
                                                                                                                                                                              5. LiveSell.net
                                                                                                                                                                              6. StrategyAuction.com
                                                                                                                                                                              7. RealTimeAuction.net
                                                                                                                                                                              8. CrazyAuctionBargains.com
                                                                                                                                                                              9. Big-Auction.com
                                                                                                                                                                              10. WarnerBros.com
                                                                                                                                                                              11. Kwik-Buy.com
                                                                                                                                                                              12. Accessorite.com
                                                                                                                                                                              13. FlirtatioNow.com
                                                                                                                                                                              14. SalesShack.com
                                                                                                                                                                              15. causalsneakers.com
                                                                                                                                                                              16. ShoesSneakers.com
                                                                                                                                                                              17. PulseOffers.com
                                                                                                                                                                              18. ShoppingSnap.com
                                                                                                                                                                              19. WalMart.com
                                                                                                                                                                              20. CyberErotica.com

                                                                                                                                                                              Shouldn't we stop doing business with all the companies on this list? You don't want to indrectly support this spyware botnet russian scamming bullshit!

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                                                                                                                                                                                • RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                                  So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                  • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                                                                  • 9465
                                                                                                                                                                                  #45
                                                                                                                                                                                  vvg, welcome to "junior high school debate squad" horseshit. Congrats for the major attempt to shift the discussion from scumbags using the adult net infrastructure to make money to my choice of stores to shop at.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Outside of walmat, I don't knowingly do business with any of those companies, and if your information is true (ie, you have a source other than some dubmass's free hosted blog), then I will strike walmart of the list as well.

                                                                                                                                                                                  But, none of that, not one little bit of it, excuses anyone from "selling installs" and it doesn't excuse your company from buying traffic that is almost certainly scumware re-directs.

                                                                                                                                                                                  But we won't let something like actual close to home bother you, right?

                                                                                                                                                                                  I am certain that you have bought more traffic from these guys than I have spent at Walmart this year.

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                                                                                                                                                                                    • baddog
                                                                                                                                                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                      • Apr 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                      • 107089
                                                                                                                                                                                      #46
                                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                                      Why do I start to think you make money on toolbar installs?
                                                                                                                                                                                      Because you are an idiot? Just a guess.

                                                                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                        • vvq
                                                                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                          • Feb 2004
                                                                                                                                                                                          • 2732
                                                                                                                                                                                          #47
                                                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                                          vvg, welcome to "junior high school debate squad" horseshit. Congrats for the major attempt to shift the discussion from scumbags using the adult net infrastructure to make money to my choice of stores to shop at.

                                                                                                                                                                                          Outside of walmat, I don't knowingly do business with any of those companies, and if your information is true (ie, you have a source other than some dubmass's free hosted blog), then I will strike walmart of the list as well.

                                                                                                                                                                                          But, none of that, not one little bit of it, excuses anyone from "selling installs" and it doesn't excuse your company from buying traffic that is almost certainly scumware re-directs.

                                                                                                                                                                                          But we won't let something like actual close to home bother you, right?

                                                                                                                                                                                          I am certain that you have bought more traffic from these guys than I have spent at Walmart this year.
                                                                                                                                                                                          Who am I supposed to believe about the legalities of Zango? Even if I got my information from someones freehosted blog, is that source somehow less creditable than GFY? I typed Zango into Google and this came in a few pages deep. http://www.zangoblacklist.com/

                                                                                                                                                                                          I imagine WalMart, Warner Bros, and all those companies do business with them. Who would of thought such well respected companies would be involved in the seedy underbelly of internet commerce? The russians are fucked now. Corporate America is busting in on the botnet game. Get real...

                                                                                                                                                                                          And I already told you i don't deal with scum traffic at all. Quit being a fucking dickhead. If I'm telling you i don't deal with that shit, i don't. It doesn't make your argument any better to keep saying I do. I'm expressing my opinion here, no one elses. Morally I won't have anything to do with spyware. But if the Zango guys are operating legally I'm not gonna get my panties in a twist over what they're doing. Instead I've taken steps to make sure my cookies aren't being overwritten and that my traffic isn't being stolen. It seems like the smart thing to do.

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                                                                                                                                                                                            • baddog
                                                                                                                                                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                              • Apr 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                              • 107089
                                                                                                                                                                                              #48
                                                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                                              Sort of like asking a board member of GM to ask the CEO why they don't build more electric cars.
                                                                                                                                                                                              More like asking the janitor to ask the CEO. WTF do you this his position is there?

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                                                                                                                                                                                                • spacedog
                                                                                                                                                                                                  Yes that IS me. Bitch.
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • Nov 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • 14149
                                                                                                                                                                                                  #49
                                                                                                                                                                                                  So this is where the affiliate link stealing codecs come from?

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                    • stickyfingerz
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Doin fine
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • Oct 2005
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • 24984
                                                                                                                                                                                                      #50
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Fyi myspace sells advertising for zango. They advertise DIRECTLY for Zango.com fyi.. epassporte should stop allowing transactions to myspace I think...

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