how are things looking with tgp2?

"One thing I've noticed so far not one tgp2 webmaster making claims about money has yet posted the url to their site

Give us the formula here for your successful tgp2 sites tgp2 webmasters."

Why does everyone always want easy answers?

Why does everyone always want a FORMULA for success?

What is wrong with figuring things out yourself?
What is wrong with experimentation?
What is wrong with hard work?
What is wrong for discovering formulas yourself?

One thing that hasn't been addressed by TGP2, which supposedly was one of the stronger arguments for it in the beginnning, is where the gallery maker fits in? You say to build a TGP2 site. What if yu don't wnt to run a tgp2? What if you only want to make galleries? This, to me, is where tgp2 has fallen on it's collective ass.

It has been stressed time and again that you can use fewer pictures and more ads but so far, as a gallery maker only for tgp2 sites, I haven't seen the benefit. I've made less than $20 by merely submitting galleries, using the same sponsors I use for tgp galleries. When I submit a tgp gallery, I make a decent bit of coin. When I submit a tgp2 gallery using the same sponsors, I make nothing. And now, after a few months, the key is to run a tgp2 instead of making galleries instead of make money building tgp2 galleries.

The gallerymaker has become extinct in the tgp2 world as a standalone unit, IMHO.

And obviously I can't hold a coherent thought together long enough to type it out properly

DarkSoft,

I have always said the key to TGP2 is to own a TGP2. Always. Of course, i think making TGP1 gallery makers sucks too.

However, there are other TGP2ers that have different opinions than mine. For the record, I think the environment for TGP2 gallery makers is more friendly today than it was 30 days ago. I have seen some that weren't accepting submissions now accepting them.

Yep. That is 100% true. Gallery makers in the world of TGP2 are considered useless, non essential and treated like second class citizens. That is probably one of the biggest reasons why people don't stop making TGP1 galleries and switch to TGP2. If you're gonna get treated like shit, you might as well get a few hundred thousand hits and make some cash at the same time.

Wow do you belong to a cult? whatever you do, dont buy black nike shoes and drink the jello they pass around at the TGP 2 meetings

Colin you took my entier statements out of context and you know that.

I was not asking for the formula...I was being sarcastic I already knew what it was re-read the post.

Your formula for success and you ended up posting it in response to sarcastic dude after I made my post is for people to build tgp2 site and only list their own tgp2 galleries....this secret formula isn't so secret it's been applied to tgp1 sites that are making serious bank.

Also proof is in the pudding...you've got guys coming in here claiming their sites are making such and such dollar amount...that doesn't mean a hill of beans. I just asked to see these sites they claim make this money.

I made $500 a day last week off of my tgp1.

Now I typed that out...does that make it necessarily true?

part of my point exactly. cuz when you started this thing who did you target? newbies damn near all newbies and a few sheep.
the gallery maker was never alive cuz these are circle jerks and a cj with content or without is a cj.
colin your numbers, thats all join for free kinda stuff. BIG DEAL.
now show me some numbers with sponsors beside the for free crap. you can't that's the facts.
oh you started this 2 weeks before being hired. BIG DEAL. what i said still stands without the job you wouldnt be pushing this crap.
and yea i know wolf shave and you split but that was the original deal, you both pushing whoever you work for or whatever program you own. that's a fact. and no your not one of the more popular boards. sorry nope i got more members than you and i am small shit. more of your typical bullshit.
smart guys dare to be different and not follow the crowd.
all of my posts on this subject are with a ratio of 6 times less
sarcasm than usual
i am not martin
ltrz

How do you figure that? We trade traffic like the majority of regular tgp's do....no more, no less. I post other people's galleries as well...I have none of my own on my site even unless I submit them like anyone else.

Eroswebmaster,

No it doesn't make it true. I can only tell you MY stats. I can't make up your mind for you as to whether you should believe them or not. They are not extravagant claims AT ALL. I am completely surprised that you have any question at all. What do you find difficult to believe if anything?

You can judge my by my character. You can try it yourself. You can ask around. Whatever. Doesn't matter to me.

FATPAD,

"Gallery makers in the world of TGP2 are considered useless, non essential and treated like second class citizens"?

Come on now. You know as well as I that when we opened TGP2.COM we included a monthly column called "The Gallery Maker's Perspective" and editorials and now a monthly column by Falcon, a TGP2 gallery maker.

The voice of the TGP2 Gallery maker is being heard.

Not too long ago, I opened up submissions to TGP2 gallery makers on 5 of my TGP2s. I think there have been some positive moves for TGP2 gallery makers in the past. Y'all gotta LOBBY ;)

"and yea i know wolf shave and you split but that was the original deal, you both pushing whoever you work for or whatever program you own. that's a fact. and no your not one of the more popular boards. sorry nope i got more members than you and i am small shit. more of your typical bullshit"

Oh, now I know you are a complete idiot. The second I set foot on his board Wolfshade attacked TGP2 Bucks, Insite, and me. I have never even mentioned any of his programs in public. Split from what? Do you just make this stuff up as you go along?

As to your statement regarding board popularity.

Your board has had 1290 posts in the General Section since October 28 and has 241 registered members.

We opened Feb. 10 and have had 2844 posts and 163 members.

We're kicking your ass.

On March 8, we checked some WM boards and here were the totals. I'll include your board in the official total now. To tell you the truth, you may want to check your totals as I was getting bored going through all the categories looking for needles in haystacks and added a few on to give you the benefit of the doubt.

GFY - 894 posts
Oprano - 359 posts
TGP2.COM - 94 posts
Netpond - 47 posts
YNOT - 30 posts
Surprise - 17 posts
SarcasticBastards - 16 posts

GFY rules the roost. No doubt.

yep 241 members and growing at 2 to 5 a day so that is true.
. To tell you the truth, you may want to check your totals as I was getting bored going through all the categories looking for needles in haystacks and added a few on to give you the benefit of the doubt.
your to fuckin funny. there is more real info on search engines, tgp1 and avs site building on my board than any board except toms newbie board.
on that day or any day the reason the number of posts on my board maybe less than others is because...

we don't care if your fuckin cat died.
we dont' care about your personal life.
we don't do the we are a community thing
we do business and alot less bullshitting around than anywhere.
so yea my post counts are lower than some.
my board clicks average over 2k a day
now my board is busy as all hell and i gotta go.
ltrz

You forgot one SB..
We don't play bingo..

"i gotta go.'

Bye!

See, that's where you're wrong. I don't list my own galleries, simply because I have no time to make any. I have other full-time engagements and I simply cannot (God knows I've tried) the extra time to make the extra buck. I have a shitload of ideas just piling up in my head, just waiting for me to give'em a go, making and listing my own galleries is one of them. But if I ever did that, I wouldn't list them on any of my existing sites, that would mean fucking things up for other gallery makers who I know work hard for the bucks they earn. So sometime in the, hopefully, near future, I'll make some new TGP2's on which I'll list my own galleries only. Until that day, I'm still making money on my TGP2 sites without listing a single gallery made by me.

And just for the record, I never did TGP, I never owned one and thus I was never good at it.

And sorry for the namecalling, it just slipped my tongue.

I post TGP2 galleries and also own a TGP2 site. The thing that I see most from it is a much better click-thru to sponsor ratio.

TGP2 gives me the flexibility to me more creative with my galleries. Allowing pics on HTML is critical to this as it allows you to get a second chance at getting the surfer to the sponsor. the whole point of giving away free pics is to show the surfer the quality of the content, it is ludicrious that TGP1 has not allowed webmasters to place links underneath ful size images.

Here is a recent gallery that I have posted and some early results.

http://www.adult-paysites.com/tgp2/k...002/index.html

That gallery has only had approx 1350 unique hits, but has sent 120 hits to the sponsor.

An indentical gallery posted on TGP1 sites (but with 10pics and no pics on html) has recieved over 40,000 unique hits and generated only 100 hits to the sponsor.

I think part of the problem in this business is that people focus too much on raw numbers and not on the bottom line.

When I first started in this business it was difficult for a surfer to find free hardcore images and free videos were pretty much non-existent. Nowadays, the web is flooded with it and people sit there and wonder why sponsors are converting at 1:1500 and worse.

Well, we all know the idea behind TGP2 sites.

The idea really has to do with a new or inexperienced surfer find a tgp2 post site, and then get hungry for more content, and then click on your sponsors.

I did ok when I tried some out myself, enough to bother setting up tgp2 content for our cash program. Still, there is that problem with original TGPs giving out more content, and being easier to find. Best TGP2s can do to get surfers, is get high up on search engine traffic, and get the surfers that way.

Homegrown, you're partly right.

But let's not forget that the TGP's wouldn't exist if there weren't enough webmasters to feed them with excellent galleries.

As for the SE traffic part, it's being done as we speak.

Pfff, same shit every 4 weeks or so... :p

One of the biggest reasons for TGP2 was to get less porn online, which means more money for us webmasters. That seems to be generally known.
A lot of sponsors have already increased payouts to TGP2 webmasters, many give out a 10%-30% tgp2 bonus.
It might be very wishfull thinking, but as sponsors play a big deal in this stuff, it would be ideal if one day - when the breaking point comes - sponsors include in there rules, that their content may not be used for TGP1 and some other little rules like that. That would be the time many tgp1 webmasters will convert.

Like I said, might be a longshot, but it is worth to think about, they cannot give away their content forever in those amounts.

Lets just scroll past that comment a few lines....

oh um.... Could it be that you just contradicted yourself and proved my point without me even needed to be awake?

TGP1 surfers do bookmark TGP2 sites. They do return and they do signup at sponsors.

No market is getting reshaped.... A whole new one was created. A market designed from the start for max turnover and min costs. A market that has a profit margin for even the most hopeless webmaster.

I've never been profitable in TGP1.... I've used it to feed CJ sites and toplists but never seen any direct profit when posting paysites.... Maybe I'm just hopeless... but any fool can make money in TGP2....

I can hear some saying "well that's your mistake selling paysites not evidence eliminator".... Well I don't sell things that make my life harder in future. Selling an evidence eliminator today means not getting credited for a paysite signup or traffic trade tomorrow (it deletes cookies). I can make money selling paysites in TGP2 without having to cut my own throat.

Yeah that's what I don't get.... It's like there is something to lose.... When there simply isn't a damn thing to lose.

So many TGP1 owners seem to know so much about what TGP2 is and isn't :-)

We'll take experienced TGP1 surfers too..... They'll convert better on TGP2 site then they did on TGP1 sites so all traffic is worth it for the TGP2 webmaster.

Shit one of my 500 hit TGP2 sites probably makes more than a lot of 10k+ TGP1 sites. Does that have anything to do with the bulk mega traffic pool that I didn't have? Posting a few galleries and putting a few links up is more than enough to get a TGP2 site off the ground.

-Ben

You Bastard! My cat died today!

whats a CJ2?

Was looking at a tgp2 sites submissions page and saw that term.

It is DEAD!!!!!

Not so - it's very much alive and kicking.

As of now, TGP2 is viewed as nothing more than a CJ site with content which caters only to TGP2 owners. Without a LL2 system to support TGP2, few gallery makers will consider it as a viable alternative to TGP1.

TGP2 gallery makers should be much more prolific. It is not TGP. You only use 5 pics, so you should make about four TGP2 galleries/day, if you are used to making one 20 pic TGP gallery (roughly standard). And that is if you are looking for a minimum number. I don't buy into this "TGP2 screws the gallery builder" line of shit. I have listed galleries from the TGP2 pool from the time I opened up. I never even considered installing a submit script and demanding recips. If it makes the pool, chances are it will be on my site.

Another thing people sem to be missing is the freedom TGP2 allows the gallery builder. Yes, more aggressive gallery pages are allowed. Hell, they are encouraged. But there has been a return to "old school" tactics. I am talking about shit I did back in 97. Loading full size pics on html pages, ads on these pic pages, and even linking the fucking pic on the html page (yeah, I think this should be allowed - I do it on mine, it helps).

I also see some anti CC/Wolfshade sentiments. Well, I think they have been good for webmasters, overall. Those two have brought up some very good tactics to use in TGP2(and any other form of traffic you can apply it to). Namely, squeezing every possible penny out of surfers. Bill from PMB told me to do this long ago, and if I listened to him more often, maybe I'd be retired/semi-retired, too. Basically, it boils down to this. Link to FPA/HPAs, not tours. On these ad pages, you need to pop a blur(for free sponsors work great). You should have an e-mail collection box(your own script, a 4 free - but fucking something for the cheap cocksuckers), a dialer link on the page (for guys with no credit cards/or from Europe where dialers seem to be preferred). You should then also pop exit consoles off these pages(again, using 4free, dialers, nocash dialers, or perhaps your AVS hub page/traffic pump page). Do all this, and you will make money. I'm not a genius, I'm not a magician, but I do this and I make more money when I do. It's just working smarter. getting the most out of your time.

And for anyone who asked to see URLs. You have got to be kidding me. What fucking bus did you just come in on? Posting URLs on a webmaster BBS is fucking stupid. I'll only show you what I have to show you. Even if YOU don't rip me off, 500 other fuckfaces will. I learned that years ago on AVS boards.

So what's that make TGP1?
A CJ site with content which only caters to TGP1 owners?

Why would we need LL2?
You can make free sites from TGP2 galleries easy.

What about the hundreds of gallery makers already supporting it?

This is just totally silly.... Why are there so many ppl that don't know anything about TGP2 ready to spell out exactly what it is in under 3 words.

-Ben

It is like organic foods (at least here is the US).

Years ago a person who was involved in producing organic food was looked upon as a nutcase. Why bother to eat something produced naturally when petrochemicals are so good for you.

Over time it became more popular and more profitable.

Now the big corporations are involved and it has become mainstream.

Who gives a fuck? TGP1 or TGP2. I do both.

Yeah, in all honesty there are only about 10-15 tgp2's worth submitting to that will send you some decent traffic back.

I don't think it is dead, it just hasn't matured enough. It has really only been around since September of last year, it is only like 6 months old.

Does tgp2 convert better than tgp1. yes it does, but that has alot to do with the function of traffic. I don't think it is so much that because there are only 5 pic galleries to make the srfer want to join, I think it is because alot of the beginning rules, no tgp1 trades, meant that the traffic had to come from better sources. Alot of newbies came on board feeding tgp2 with se and avs traffic because they thought tgp2 was going to be the shit.

TGP2 IS the shit! :D

Won't take my word for it? Get off your lazy ass and try it. Get yourself AHK free and submit to 100 TGP2's without a recip, submit to the gallery pools as well, and you WILL make sales.

that's true because no one could unite the tgp2 owners from the start. i decided to give it a try one day and after 1 hour, i found out that i have to create like 31 different templates for 33 different tgp2s. i'm talking of:

-- only 5 pics; 5-10 pics; just 5 pics linked and 10 unlinked.
-- no recip, central recip, at least 2 other recips
-- full pics on html 1 ad, full pics on html 2 ads, no full pics on html

that's just a few. i found it more than stupid to spend 4 hours a day making some tgp2 galleries, submit them and get 100 hits in return.

right from the start, you should have worked as 1 webmaster - the same rules, at the least. you acted like children and each one of you decided to play the big-shot game creating more and more ridiculous rules - seemingly, just to look different from the rest.

that's what killed the whole idea. ah, and please, stop talking bullshit about MORE income from tgp2. this is simply not true. why? simple - because it is STILL a tgp no matter how many thumbs are linked.

This is easy. One TGP2 visitor is worth 6x what a TGP1 visitor is. Why? One reason is that there is
much more ad space.

Pics allowed on HTML pages. This is huge. I send a LOT of visitors from my HTML pages to the sponsors.

With only 5 pics per gallery, the ads both above and below the thumbs are more easily seen.

TGP1 doesn't have consistent rules either. Some require 20 pics. Some don't. Some require certain sized thumbs. Some require recip links. Some don't. How do you manage all that?

People don't try different rules just to look different from the rest. People try different rules because they believe those rules will work better for them and make them more money. The better ideas will will in the end.

The bottom line is TGP2 is here to stay. It is a very viable free site model. It started in the middle of July of last year and is still here. In 4 more months, it will have been around a year. That's a pretty long time for our business.

Love it Hate it. It makes noise.

Just like me.

Yes and so does my asshole..but it doesn't mean it's worth investigating

Hey, is this where I join the Porn Barons?

=o)

You know what I think is soo funny:

Watching this whole debate - and seeing what are suppose to be "adults" acting like children!! WTG!!

I mean, honestly people, why do you TGP1 people hate TGP2? And the same for TGP2??

Why don't you just do both and see what works for YOU.

We are all in this business (at least that's what I thought it was) to make money, right?

So do whatever you want to do to make YOUR living and go on with life.

We all have our personal opinions about both TGP1 and TGP2, and we are all free to voice those opinions...but at least do it in an "adult" manner.

That is all...you can go about your debate now.

Colin,

As you state above, if you want to make money with TGP2, make a TGP2 site. Well, I don't want to start a TGP2 site, I have enough to do right now. However, DamageX's claim that making tgp2 galleries and submitting them to the pools and using AHK for the other submits and it brings sales is false. I have been doing that with results that I am now getting less traffic to my galleries than I was when the tgp2 movement started, by a factor of about 10x less. I am lucky to get 500 uniques to a gallery and no sales.

Your tgp2 traffic may be making YOU money, but for a gallery maker ONLY, it is worthless, IMHO.

"Yes and so does my asshole..but it doesn't mean it's worth investigating"

A full investigation is pending. Lisa is on her way over.

JustDave,

I don't hate TGP1. I own about 10 TGP1s. I also own 10 TGP2s.

Given that I have experience running TGP1s with anywhere from 5k to 110k/day AND many TGP2s, I can safely say that I am one of only a few webmasters that can safely compare the two for a wide range of traffic numbers.

For the large majority of webmasters, they would make more MONEY running TGP2s than TGP1s.

There are exceptions. Use the 6x rule. If you can get 60k TGP1 traffic, you have to compare that to 10k TGP1. Which is easier for you?

I would say any webmaster that has been running a TGP1 for 3 months or more and has less than 30k traffic would make more money in TGP2 very fast than they make in TGP1. If you can get 30k TGP1 traffic, you can get 5k TGP2 traffic. Same money AND less bandwidth.