Adult Friend Finder position statement

I can't believe this thread isn't 20 pages long yet .

Lar's you're a fucking thief.

Anyone that runs a program as successful as yours would have to know what was happening.

You did this entirely to steal sales from your affiliates, so you wouldn't have to payout anything.

2 million paid out to zango to highjack your affiliates codes and tracking is alot easier on you than paying out god knows what in affiliate payouts.

You knew full well what you were doing.

This is not looking good....

too bad I dont know any dating sponsor that converts like AFF. And anyone who says different, is a liar.

I'd rather make less money, represent what I know is right, and earn longevity in this biz.

Best advice/stance of the year

Lots of hating in this thread still - but I still dont see anything constructive.

If this issue really is that important to you put your thinking caps on and try to answer the question I asked above....

So far we have -

1. Take the Smokey approach and try to code your way out of it - dosnt really solve Lar's problem though.

2. Take legal action.

Any more?

I know its alien to most on this board, but lets try to be constructive rather than destructive for once.

There are better ones, and I ain't no liar. I quit sending much traffic to AFF, and increased my sales.

Really? Lars paid TWO MILLION DOLLARS with this ad campgian...hard to believe...I guess fucking up 'average' surfer's computers is very profitable.

I suggested already in this thread, and i guess you missed it... why doesn't AFF buy only their own keywords and do a pop under blank page, or no page at all.

...effectively turning zango into a protection racket

Opposed to what one could call what is happening now... extortion ?

AFF if you don't buy *your* keywords your competition will take your traffc... ( i am sure zango doesn't contact them and say that, but in theory that is what is happening).

It was just an option and better then what they are doing now.

zango made 50 million in 2004. How much do you think they are making now ?

This is disappointing for affiliates but you gotta remember. Don't shoot the messenger. This might not be a personal position of Lars. It's the position of the company. I'm thinking that Lars is saying what he's told to say.
...
I'd rather make less money, represent what I know is right, and earn longevity in this biz.

...effectively turning zango into a protection racket

Sexsearch will never get any of my traffic in any way shape or form no matter what happens in the future. They are non-grata as far as I am concerned.

How did I miss this thread?


The problem is known, time for some real solutions. Affiliates should be LIVID, you deserve to be. This information should not have been found out the way it did. Thank you Smokey and Will76 for beating the drum. Jayeff, your contributions here are very much appreciated.

This industry has a VERY short memory. Any wagers on the longevity of this issue?

One interesting thing in this thread is the cookie talk.

if webmasters really want to see their sales drop- they can use programs that do not hardcode their links. be careful what you wish for- revolving methods around cookies is a smokescreen. keep a year or lifetime cookie- whatever, sales still are not going to track accurately because cookies are good for a lot of things- but not for core affiliate tracking.

That is a very disingenuous comment. There are solutions just as there are choices and while Smokey's intent is admirable, that type of "solution" is on a par with advising stagecoach travellers to wear bulletproof vests.

In situations like this, there are always three options. You can go along, making the problem worse and becoming part of it. You can sit back and do nothing. You can fight the problem.

Which may sound like crusading idealism, but you run one of the largest operations in this industry which therefore suffers more than most, the consequences of working in a "wild west" environment. Think about the resources you have to put into protecting your business: those are real costs which will increase year on year if you don't act.

That realisation takes a decade or two to dawn on every new industry. But they all get there and one reason is that scammers are people with very limited horizons who simply do not belong in big business. So long as you play their game instead of your own, you are limiting yourself to their petty ambitions.

I'm speaking from experience. I started my first business with less than $5,000, working out of a two-room basement. It was built largely on a scam, like every other business of that sort at the time. It made good money. Then after a couple of years I realized that was as good as it was going to get, but that if I ran the business legitimately, there was a potentially huge market for it. So I cleaned up my own act, hired new people and trained them. Three years later, sales were into 7 figures and it was one of the biggest companies in its field.

There is no way to describe just how trivial and stupid the games that I was playing in the early 1970's seem now. I sold out in 1980. In 2004, the last year the company operated as an independent division, sales were $450 million. Now it is part of Deutsche Post who have an annual turnover of more than $70 billion. I shake my head every time I think about the early days.

Your operation has the muscle and influence to change the face of this industry and it is in your own interest to do so. If you choose to offer only fluff in response to the current issue, you may well lose only a few affiliates, easily covered by writing some more checks to Zango or whoever. But wouldn't it make more sense to begin turning situations like this to your advantage? Take the high ground and condemn scumware. Use the obvious opposition to it to beat your less ethical competitors around the head. You will gain affiliates, they will lose affiliates and you will have moved the industry a small step closer to where you need it to be.

Our business should be selling to the public: not preying on each other. That's a practical consideration, not an ethical one. There are millions of surfers out there and only a few thousand webmasters. Which market has the most potential?

One interesting thing in this thread is the cookie talk.

if webmasters really want to see their sales drop- they can use programs that do not hardcode their links. be careful what you wish for- revolving methods around cookies is a smokescreen. keep a year or lifetime cookie- whatever, sales still are not going to track accurately because cookies are good for a lot of things- but not for core affiliate tracking.

All the free games, tools, and whatever is all to get their software installed, and once it is installed, it is apparently VERY hard to get rid of (and will re-install itself or otherwise rename itself to avoid being removed entirely).

You really need to check your facts. I installed it the other day and it was easily removed. It appears to be one the cleanest adware programs out there...

Our business should be selling to the public: not preying on each other. That's a practical consideration, not an ethical one. There are millions of surfers out there and only a few thousand webmasters. Which market has the most potential?

Lots of hating in this thread still - but I still dont see anything constructive.

If this issue really is that important to you put your thinking caps on and try to answer the question I asked above....

So far we have -

1. Take the Smokey approach and try to code your way out of it - dosnt really solve Lar's problem though.

2. Take legal action.

Any more?

I know its alien to most on this board, but lets try to be constructive rather than destructive for once.

At the end of the day, it is the same story that I have seen regularly in the 11 years I have been in the adult industry:
Fuck the surfer - In this case with shitware
Fuck the affiliate by screwing him with cash
And lets get fucking richer today - Fuck tomorrow.



Bet a new thread will be started soon offering an even larger amount of cash per sign up for AFF affiliates -

This is disappointing for affiliates but you gotta remember. Don't shoot the messenger. This might not be a personal position of Lars. It's the position of the company. I'm thinking that Lars is saying what he's told to say.

I'm glad I'm not in his position. I've had to make integrity calls before and I'll tell ya what. Stale crackers with ketchup and oregano don't taste like pizza anymore after about a month. But then again, alot of affiliates trust me even more now.

I'd rather make less money, represent what I know is right, and earn longevity in this biz.

What this thread needs is some law and order...




"One website wants to be the biggest. One website just wants to keep its market share. All of this in an election year..."

I put it down to a lot of lorry drivers who can build an engine but do not have a clue about the load in the back of the truck. good delivery men but poor salesmen.

I just don't understand where the AFF legal team is.....This mess is an easy one to sort out...Are they on holiday or something???

I think the conflict between having affiliates and buying traffic from Zango is too great. You need to choose, one or the other .