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Do you think the US should do "whatever they deem necessary" to get info out of...

06-23-2006, 05:55 PM

Do you think the US should do "whatever they deem necessary" to get info out of...any terrorists they catch , like those they just got from toronto i think?

I think let em do what they want , make em listen to Michael Bolton for hours on end , torture em , whatever it takes if it will get info out and save potential future attacks........

Thoughts??????/
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06-23-2006, 05:57 PM

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06-23-2006, 05:58 PM

Originally posted by Juicy D. Links

Do you think the US should do "whatever they deem necessary" to get info out of...any terrorists they catch , like those they just got from toronto i think?

I think let em do what they want , make em listen to Michael Bolton for hours on end , torture em , whatever it takes if it will get info out and save potential future attacks........

Thoughts??????/

Part of me wants to say fuck em do what is needed to get it, but then part of me wonders what that precident sets us up for in the future..

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06-23-2006, 05:58 PM

They should be able to torture terrorists in any way they see fit. Screw the geneva conventions
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#5

06-23-2006, 06:03 PM

No because who's to know if the people they claim are terrorist's are really terrorists? There have been several "terrorists" that have been sent to our prison in Cuba that have later been released because they were found to not be terrorists.

Sure if you catch someone who is with out a doubt a tango.. have at it IMO.. Other than that, how can we know i they get the right guy unless he's a high profile one?

btw our govt is currently calling the gurllea's in countries like Columbia "terrorists" so they can get more funding and have more lax rules when they go after them.

Our govt has proven time and time again they will bend the rules to fit their need.

Last edited by crockett; 06-23-2006, 06:06 PM.

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#6

06-23-2006, 06:04 PM

Originally posted by Madcatz

They should be able to torture terrorists in any way they see fit. Screw the geneva conventions

they said something the other day that technically "we are not at war" so geneva conv rules dont apply....something like that cant recall but i heard it on tv or radio
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#7

06-23-2006, 06:07 PM

Originally posted by Juicy D. Links

they said something the other day that technically "we are not at war" so geneva conv rules dont apply....something like that cant recall but i heard it on tv or radio

Bush has been claiming that for the past two years in reguards to the Cuba prison and the other "secrect" prisions.

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06-23-2006, 06:08 PM

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#9

06-23-2006, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by Madcatz

They should be able to torture terrorists in any way they see fit. Screw the geneva conventions

I agree.... the Geneva Convention was written for wars with conventional uniformed soldiers.

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#10

06-23-2006, 06:11 PM

Originally posted by BlingDaddy

I agree.... the Geneva Convention was written for wars with conventional uniformed soldiers.

The Geneva Convention was also written to protect our own troops if they are captured during a war. How can we expect any of our enemies to treat our soldiers well if we don't do the same?

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#11

06-23-2006, 06:13 PM

Originally posted by crockett

The Geneva Convention was also written to protect our own troops if they are captured during a war. How can we expect any of our enemies to treat our soldiers well if we don't do the same?

Because our own soldiers are being beaten and mutilated when captured. So fuck them, torture them if it means we're saving american lives.
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#12

06-23-2006, 06:16 PM

i don't think so
while it does sound like a good process to take
but think of it this way , if your your torturing someone , putting them in pain , they are going to tell you anything to make it stop , the info being the truth or just made up because that's what the interogater wants to hear
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#13

06-23-2006, 06:17 PM

Originally posted by biftek

i don't think so
while it does sound like a good process to take
but think of it this way , if your your torturing someone , putting them in pain , they are going to tell you anything to make it stop , the info being the truth or just made up because that's what the interogater wants to hear

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#14

06-23-2006, 06:22 PM

Originally posted by crockett

The Geneva Convention was also written to protect our own troops if they are captured during a war. How can we expect any of our enemies to treat our soldiers well if we don't do the same?

I don't really expect any country to treat any prisoners "fairly". In war, there isn't so much a right and wrong as there is a can and can't. Everything gets judged afterwards, and by that point it really doesn't matter anymore because everything is said and done.

War law was always such a funny concept to me. All laws are always pushed to their limits. War is no different.

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#15

06-23-2006, 06:23 PM

Originally posted by biftek

i don't think so
while it does sound like a good process to take
but think of it this way , if your your torturing someone , putting them in pain , they are going to tell you anything to make it stop , the info being the truth or just made up because that's what the interogater wants to hear

I'm not sure about that. Lies are fairly easily detected, especially to somebody trained with that psychology. Plus the lies will always show through after the information is used and proven wrong.

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#16

06-23-2006, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by Madcatz

They should be able to torture terrorists in any way they see fit. Screw the geneva conventions

May someday you be accused of being a terrorist.

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#17

06-23-2006, 06:28 PM

The ratio of stupid posts to intelligent posts in this thread is insane!
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#18

06-23-2006, 06:42 PM

Making me listen to Michael Bolton would work. I do consider that torture.

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06-23-2006, 07:28 PM
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#20

06-23-2006, 07:30 PM

Originally posted by Juicy D. Links

I think let em do what they want , make em listen to Michael Bolton for hours on end , torture em , whatever it takes if it will get info out and save potential future attacks

Damn straight they should

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#21

06-23-2006, 08:10 PM

torture - no. Listening to some freack - o'k

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#22

06-23-2006, 08:11 PM

is Mr. Izzz muslim? why not ask him?

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#23

06-23-2006, 08:12 PM

The US is a signatory to the Geneva Conventions. Those conventions and their protocols declare there is treatment to which countries must never resort, even in time of war.

Which means that we are claiming a certain moral high ground abroad and with our own citizens. That latter is perhaps the most important, because our government should not let its own citizens believe it behaves in one way, then in fact behave differently. It is an elected government, something which becomes meaningless if it acts contrary to the way it encourages the public to believe it is acting.

If the powers-that-be believe they must now abandon the Geneva Conventions, they have a duty to sell that belief to American voters and should not act arbitrarily.
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#24

06-23-2006, 09:01 PM

Originally posted by Madcatz

Because our own soldiers are being beaten and mutilated when captured. So fuck them, torture them if it means we're saving american lives.

They weren't before ( Jessica Lynch and the others )....

But after Abu Gharib, the numerous executions of civilians, looks like they decided to be " not so nice " ...

But progress is made and the world is a safer place.

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#25

06-23-2006, 09:09 PM

I think it's clear the admin have been lying to the public and telling off a lot of bullshit, so definitly not. they could juste use the "stalin" techniques and get everybody that don't agree with them out of the map slowly.

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#26

06-23-2006, 09:49 PM

nothing too extreme, like mutilation, but sleep deprivation and loud noises, bright lights flashing is alright with me.
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#27

06-23-2006, 09:52 PM

I think if you decide to live by the sword, then you got it coming right back to you.

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#28

06-23-2006, 11:24 PM

When you set yourself up as morally superior you had better act it. Or lose the trust of people.

The saying "Fight fire with fire" does not work in this scenario. Israel has been doing it for over 50 years and now worse off, less safe than they have ever been since the 7 day war.

If you want to win people over, make theirs lives better. Give them the benefits, the ones understand, of our way of life. These are food, protection, hospitals, roads, electricity, entertainment, fun and enjoyment.

Don't use the same or worse tactics to defeat your enemy to win over the people.

For instance. Terrorists put the people around them at risk because they know who those people will blame when the gun ships, tanks and rockets kill the children and pregnant women in retaliation to their rockets which are largely ineffective.

So the answer to your question is NO.

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#29

06-23-2006, 11:56 PM

Originally posted by Paul Markham

When you set yourself up as morally superior you had better act it. Or lose the trust of people.

The saying "Fight fire with fire" does not work in this scenario. Israel has been doing it for over 50 years and now worse off, less safe than they have ever been since the 7 day war.

If you want to win people over, make theirs lives better. Give them the benefits, the ones understand, of our way of life. These are food, protection, hospitals, roads, electricity, entertainment, fun and enjoyment.

Don't use the same or worse tactics to defeat your enemy to win over the people.

For instance. Terrorists put the people around them at risk because they know who those people will blame when the gun ships, tanks and rockets kill the children and pregnant women in retaliation to their rockets which are largely ineffective.

So the answer to your question is NO.

Good post Paul!

I suspect the "morally superior" has already failed - not just in the Middle East, but around the globe.

It's obvious there are already US toture camps and already more than enough data been published. The more this continues it simply ingnites more action and there will come times of paybacks - and there won't be a winner in sight.

Again.. an old story - why is the US in Iraq in the first place? This was a chosen avenue and it will have it's real cost - suspect we ain't seen anything yet.

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06-26-2006, 07:51 PM
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#31

06-26-2006, 07:52 PM

yu cant do whatever necessary and make everyone happy

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#32

06-26-2006, 08:10 PM

The needs of the many...outweigh the needs of the few.

Let the torture continue.

Can't please everyone...
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#33

06-26-2006, 08:12 PM

by any means
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#34

06-26-2006, 08:35 PM

Originally posted by Sly

I'm not sure about that. Lies are fairly easily detected, especially to somebody trained with that psychology. Plus the lies will always show through after the information is used and proven wrong.

just like the WMD intel right.

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