Ever think about becoming a fast food Franchisee?

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  • Deputy Chief Command
    Deputy Chief Command
    • Nov 2005
    • 4482
    #51
    Hershie , it seems you have some knowledge on franchise, but it seems there is one thing you DONT have namely knowledge on a SUCCESFULL franchise,

    yours obviously did not work out ,but I am sure that this does not mean ALL franchises are going to flop ;)

      Comment

      • ace0r
        Confirmed User
        • Feb 2001
        • 1410
        #52
        Originally posted by Veterans Day
        pakistani indians
        what's a pakistani indian?

          Comment

          • Sly
            Let's do some business!
            • Sep 2004
            • 31379
            #53
            Originally posted by hershie
            I had the "Master Franchise" for Syracuse, NY, meaning a lot of money was put up so I had exclusivity for a big city to develop Dunkin Donuts shops. I had an aggresive opening schedule of new shops though to maintain the master franchise (7 shops in 5 years), but the staffing issues stopped me in my tracks PERIOD. Finding managers and decent kids was so hard I couldn't expand and thought I would have a heart attack before I turned 40.

            I sold out and opened up an Internet biz. in Silicon Valley.
            It sounds like you killed yourself trying to expand before you had one store nailed. Having a "master franchise" is a lot different than running one location. Seven shops in 5 years without someone good helping is pretty hardcore, almost as if you were doomed the second you started.
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              • hershie
                Confirmed User
                • Jun 2002
                • 4642
                #54
                Originally posted by Deputy Chief Command
                Hershie , it seems you have some knowledge on franchise, but it seems there is one thing you DONT have namely knowledge on a SUCCESFULL franchise,

                yours obviously did not work out ,but I am sure that this does not mean ALL franchises are going to flop ;)
                Sorry but my franchises were very successful and profitable. I am pointing out the surrounding issues and highlighting the realities of the business, to help people like you who see the business through rose coloured glasses.

                  Comment

                  • Deputy Chief Command
                    Deputy Chief Command
                    • Nov 2005
                    • 4482
                    #55
                    Originally posted by hershie
                    Sorry but my franchises were very successful and profitable. I am pointing out the surrounding issues and highlighting the realities of the business, to help people like you who see the business through rose coloured glasses.

                    thanks for the advise then , but succes is not the same as failure

                    if I look back on succes I speak positive

                    If I look back on failure I speak negative

                      Comment

                      • Veterans Day
                        Confirmed User
                        • Jul 2003
                        • 8403
                        #56
                        Originally posted by ace0r
                        what's a pakistani indian?
                        there all fucking indians to me, you know the ones, especially if you live in the city There cool and all with their barely coherent accents, but we all know the only cheaper people in the world are chinese porn consumers
                        Build a Massive Traffic Network, Hands FREE, Totally Automated

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                          • QuaWee
                            Confirmed User
                            • Jul 2004
                            • 5791
                            #57
                            Originally posted by Veterans Day
                            well if you know about indians, you know they are quite possibly the cheapest motherfuckers on the planet, and you know damn well his labor costs are next to zero with the whole family working with him. THINK. It comes down to location. I see alot of subways tucked into strip malls on the far ends hoping to save 300 a month on rent, but that kills the traffic, whammmmmmy
                            stereotypes are cool
                            i luv mainstream

                              Comment

                              • detoxed
                                vip member
                                • Jan 2003
                                • 17798
                                #58
                                Originally posted by $5 submissions
                                Like any other businessman, diversification crosses my mind a lot. I've learned that after 6 years in this biz (I started in 2000), that NOTHING can be taken for granted. This goes for traffic, for business models, for promotion models, and overall strategy. So I've been thinking about offline diversification as well. Since I split my time between the US and The Philippines, I've come across differing business diversification opportunities on both sides of the Pacific.
                                One particular opportunity involves fast food.

                                IF you were able to, would you get into fastfood franchising? If so, which chain would you like to be a franchisee of?

                                Let's forget about the obvious big ones like McDonalds. Any other chain?

                                If not fastfood, what type of business would like to get a franchise in?

                                In the US, a PIZZA shop (specially in newly built subdivisions) looks attractive... maybe Papa John's?
                                In high school my friend (a hot chick) had a family member who owend a dominos they seemed to have a lot of money.

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                                    • Nov 2003
                                    • 32189
                                    #59
                                    Originally posted by ace0r
                                    what's a pakistani indian?
                                    Indians or maybe Hindus that live in Pakistan? Actually, Pakistan and India were part of the same country during the British Raj. The country was split into two to give Moslems a homeland in the late 40s. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Pakistan

                                      Comment

                                      • Veterans Day
                                        Confirmed User
                                        • Jul 2003
                                        • 8403
                                        #60
                                        Originally posted by QuaWee
                                        stereotypes are cool
                                        stereotypes exist for one reason or another, alot of the times they fit the bill. Denying indians are cheapasses is just silly. Cheers
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                                          • hershie
                                            Confirmed User
                                            • Jun 2002
                                            • 4642
                                            #61
                                            Originally posted by Deputy Chief Command
                                            thanks for the advise then , but succes is not the same as failure

                                            if I look back on succes I speak positive

                                            If I look back on failure I speak negative

                                            There is a wide chasm between the romantic notions people have about opening up a food franchise or a bed-and-breakfast and the reality of operating them. I am trying to fill in the chasm a bit if possible. I have lots of good things to say too but a dose of seeing how bad things can get is also healthy to read.

                                              Comment

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                                                • Nov 2003
                                                • 32189
                                                #62
                                                Originally posted by hershie
                                                Sorry but my franchises were very successful and profitable. I am pointing out the surrounding issues and highlighting the realities of the business, to help people like you who see the business through rose coloured glasses.

                                                I for one sincerely appreciate your comments since they add realism and nuance to this discussion. While it's good to see the upside of an opportunity, in oder to succeed it's important to approach opportunities knowing the downside and challenges as well.

                                                  Comment

                                                  • Alex
                                                    So Fucking Banned (YEA!!)
                                                    • Jun 2004
                                                    • 10963
                                                    #63
                                                    Originally posted by hershie
                                                    Get the FTC Disclosure booklet and they will list right there the average gross sales (as well as all the various costs on average throughout their system in your area...) and I will bet that $75K number is in the top 2% of franchisees. If you think you are that brilliant that you can pick and secure a location that can produce that too, than I say grab it!
                                                    Of course not. THe guy making 75k gross is probably in the top 2%.

                                                    With franchises like these you have to find a good key location, and have a few of them.
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                                                      Comment

                                                      • Alex
                                                        So Fucking Banned (YEA!!)
                                                        • Jun 2004
                                                        • 10963
                                                        #64
                                                        Originally posted by detoxed
                                                        In high school my friend (a hot chick) had a family member who owend a dominos they seemed to have a lot of money.


                                                        Best post in this thread.
                                                        Care about me?
                                                        Who?
                                                        Me!
                                                        Who?

                                                          Comment

                                                          • QuaWee
                                                            Confirmed User
                                                            • Jul 2004
                                                            • 5791
                                                            #65
                                                            Originally posted by Veterans Day
                                                            stereotypes exist for one reason or another, alot of the times they fit the bill. Denying indians are cheapasses is just silly. Cheers
                                                            lol, damn you are ignorant
                                                            i luv mainstream

                                                              Comment

                                                              • Sly
                                                                Let's do some business!
                                                                • Sep 2004
                                                                • 31379
                                                                #66
                                                                Originally posted by QuaWee
                                                                lol, damn you are ignorant
                                                                If he's wrong, please inform us how stereotypes are formed?

                                                                Yes, they can often be wrong and its a little silly to solely judge someone based on stereotypes alone, but they are formed for a reason.
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                                                                  • hershie
                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                    • Jun 2002
                                                                    • 4642
                                                                    #67
                                                                    Originally posted by Sly
                                                                    It sounds like you killed yourself trying to expand before you had one store nailed. Having a "master franchise" is a lot different than running one location. Seven shops in 5 years without someone good helping is pretty hardcore, almost as if you were doomed the second you started.
                                                                    Yes, under estimating the issues surrounding staffing requirements was a massive flaw. I had my brother in-law there to help but his role was more securing real estate for future locations...than operations and I just couldn't find decent staff and especially competent management that could allow me to sleep peacefully. We had over 100 employees and since the stores were open 24/7, having good trained enthusiatic managers was the only way to expand beyond 2 stores without triggering a nervous breakdown.

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                                                                        • Nov 2003
                                                                        • 32189
                                                                        #68
                                                                        Originally posted by Alex


                                                                        Best post in this thread.
                                                                        A hot chick with an endless supply of Domino's ... who can argue with that

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • Cassavetes
                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                            • Oct 2005
                                                                            • 286
                                                                            #69
                                                                            Too many rules as a franchisee - too many obstructions for an entrepreneur - you'd get stuck in a rut quickly... i believe in developing your own brand...

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • hershie
                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                • Jun 2002
                                                                                • 4642
                                                                                #70
                                                                                You have to go to Dunkin Donuts University near Boston for around 8 weeks to be able to open a franchise. They make you learn the standards of how to properly bake the donuts...so you can teach this to staff. They have very strict specs and guidelines you must follow, and I imagine they have lessened the manufacturing burden in the years since I sold my stores since it was so bloody hard to manufacture properly prepared donuts.

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • hershie
                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                    • Jun 2002
                                                                                    • 4642
                                                                                    #71
                                                                                    Originally posted by Cassavetes
                                                                                    Too many rules as a franchisee - too many obstructions for an entrepreneur - you'd get stuck in a rut quickly... i believe in developing your own brand...
                                                                                    With Dunkin, you had to fork over 9.9% of your gross sales. Ouch. 4.9% was franchise fees and 5% advertising fees.

                                                                                    The rules were crazy and the franchisor's pimp hand was very strong in enforcing their rules on the franchisee. The franchisor could push you around all they wanted contractually and even force you to make hundreds of thousands of dollars in leasehold improvements to adopt their new colour scheme...

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                                                                                        • Nov 2003
                                                                                        • 32189
                                                                                        #72
                                                                                        Originally posted by Cassavetes
                                                                                        Too many rules as a franchisee - too many obstructions for an entrepreneur - you'd get stuck in a rut quickly... i believe in developing your own brand...
                                                                                        Obstructions for some may be quality and operational standards for others.

                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                          • OG LennyT
                                                                                            Wall Street Pimp
                                                                                            • Jun 2003
                                                                                            • 14345
                                                                                            #73
                                                                                            Little Caesars has customers lined up out the door on the week nights.
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                                                                                              • Alex
                                                                                                So Fucking Banned (YEA!!)
                                                                                                • Jun 2004
                                                                                                • 10963
                                                                                                #74
                                                                                                Originally posted by $5 submissions
                                                                                                A hot chick with an endless supply of Domino's ... who can argue with that
                                                                                                Care about me?
                                                                                                Who?
                                                                                                Me!
                                                                                                Who?

                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                  • $5 submissions
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                                                                                                    • Nov 2003
                                                                                                    • 32189
                                                                                                    #75
                                                                                                    Originally posted by dvd316
                                                                                                    Little Caesars has customers lined up out the door on the week nights.
                                                                                                    Same thing happened with Krispy Kreme opened in Van Nuys (it was the first SF Valley branch). My God, it's like the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, Nirvana, and the Grateful Dead appeared in one concert. Traffic for miles.


                                                                                                    Then........ the whole Low Carbs/Atkins thing hit and Krispy Kreme looked like downtown Pnomh Penh during the Khmer Rouge days. Desolate.

                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                      • hershie
                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                        • Jun 2002
                                                                                                        • 4642
                                                                                                        #76
                                                                                                        Originally posted by $5 submissions
                                                                                                        Obstructions for some may be quality and operational standards for others.
                                                                                                        It was maddening to see a franchisee in a nearby town produce crap product or let their donuts sit for sale more than the 12 hour time limit just to save some money at the cost of killing the brand for the rest of the franchisees.

                                                                                                        If you open a franchise, make sure the franchisor enforces the standards strongly as one rogue store can hurt the rest significantly.

                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                          • $5 submissions
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                                                                                                            • Nov 2003
                                                                                                            • 32189
                                                                                                            #77
                                                                                                            Originally posted by hershie
                                                                                                            It was maddening to see a franchisee in a nearby town produce crap product or let their donuts sit for sale more than the 12 hour time limit just to save some money at the cost of killing the brand for the rest of the franchisees.

                                                                                                            If you open a franchise, make sure the franchisor enforces the standards strongly as one rogue store can hurt the rest significantly.
                                                                                                            True. But Hershie, care to elaborate on the ADVANTAGES of being a franchisee as opposed to having your own brand built from scratch?

                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                              • hershie
                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                • Jun 2002
                                                                                                                • 4642
                                                                                                                #78
                                                                                                                Originally posted by $5 submissions
                                                                                                                True. But Hershie, care to elaborate on the ADVANTAGES of being a franchisee as opposed to having your own brand built from scratch?
                                                                                                                The power of a strong brand is off the charts vis a vis the success rate of a food business over one that opens without the known quantity of the name/system. For instance, the Dunkin Donuts sign near the road was the only reason I had lineups at the counter from day one. I think the 4.9% franchise fee is a steal to leverage the billions of dollars spent building up the brand over the decades and familiarity people have with the name/product...

                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                  • crockett
                                                                                                                    in a van by the river
                                                                                                                    • May 2003
                                                                                                                    • 76818
                                                                                                                    #79
                                                                                                                    $5 Chicken Wings
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                                                                                                                      • practiceTITOISM
                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                        • May 2005
                                                                                                                        • 441
                                                                                                                        #80
                                                                                                                        Originally posted by $5 submissions
                                                                                                                        In the US, a PIZZA shop (specially in newly built subdivisions) looks attractive... maybe Papa John's?
                                                                                                                        Build a pizza shop on a college campus $$$ Mad money man. Us college kids eat it like crazy!

                                                                                                                          Comment

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                                                                                                                            • Nov 2003
                                                                                                                            • 32189
                                                                                                                            #81
                                                                                                                            Originally posted by crockett
                                                                                                                            $5 Chicken Wings
                                                                                                                            With or without that kickass blue cheese dip?

                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                              • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                                I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                                • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                                • 13449
                                                                                                                                #82
                                                                                                                                As someone who managed convenience stores for 5 years, I agree that 24 hour businesses suck in a major way.

                                                                                                                                Personally I think that if you know how to run a business you're better off starting your own brand than you are going the franchise route.
                                                                                                                                All you really get with a franchise is a brand. Brands are powerful things but the negatives outweigh the positives IMHO.

                                                                                                                                With a franchise your business can be taken away from you at any time.
                                                                                                                                The convenience store chain I worked for went into acquisition mode and bought a small chain that had about 200 company owned stores and about 60 franchises.
                                                                                                                                They immediately put a team of lawyers to work at getting the franchise stores back under company control and within 2 years all the franchisees were gone.
                                                                                                                                These were people who put their life savings into their franchise businesses and in the end were left with nothing.

                                                                                                                                You either know how to run a business or you don't. Even with a franchise you're still going to have to buy equipment, a location, hire and train staff, etc etc.
                                                                                                                                The only difference is if you open Ma and Pa's sub shop nobody will know who you are whereas if you open a subway you'll probably get business immediately.
                                                                                                                                IMHO you're better off spending the franchise fee and the monthly % that you would pay to the franchisor and just spend it on advertising and marketing to build your own brand, and then you'll have a business that's 100% yours.

                                                                                                                                sig too big

                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                  • ace0r
                                                                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                    • Feb 2001
                                                                                                                                    • 1410
                                                                                                                                    #83
                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Lenny2
                                                                                                                                    These were people who put their life savings into their franchise businesses and in the end were left with nothing.
                                                                                                                                    no offense but being just a store manager, either you weren't 'in the know' on the acquisition procecess, or you are talking out of your ass.

                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                      • Mr. Marks
                                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                        • Jun 2001
                                                                                                                                        • 7517
                                                                                                                                        #84
                                                                                                                                        Anyone know the average amount of time for a KFC to return investment?

                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                          • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                                            I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                                            • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                                            • 13449
                                                                                                                                            #85
                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by ace0r
                                                                                                                                            no offense but being just a store manager, either you weren't 'in the know' on the acquisition procecess, or you are talking out of your ass.
                                                                                                                                            Who ever said I was just a store manager?

                                                                                                                                            Believe me or not, I don't care, it's not my money at risk.

                                                                                                                                            Do some research and I'm sure you'll find dozens of stories just like the one I've told about companies that changed gears and decided franchisees were no longer part of their long term business plan.
                                                                                                                                            sig too big

                                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                                              • Jensen
                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                • Apr 2001
                                                                                                                                                • 3790
                                                                                                                                                #86
                                                                                                                                                fast food still in? not up here.. more and more people getting a more healthy lifestyle so you might think about that aswell..

                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                  • hershie
                                                                                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                    • Jun 2002
                                                                                                                                                    • 4642
                                                                                                                                                    #87
                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by papichulo
                                                                                                                                                    Anyone know the average amount of time for a KFC to return investment?
                                                                                                                                                    Do a search for a Canadian company called I think Bitove or Scott's in Canada. They have hundreds of KFC franchises in Canada and turned the company into a public company trading on the stock market, so they have all sorts of financial records/disclosure info. available on the net.

                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                      • Slick
                                                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                        • Feb 2001
                                                                                                                                                        • 7338
                                                                                                                                                        #88
                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by BoNgHiTtA
                                                                                                                                                        My friend opened a Quiznos today. I am curious as to how it does for him.
                                                                                                                                                        Someone just opened up a Quiznos here about a week ago. So far, it seems to be doing really well. We'll see how it does after it's newness wears off.

                                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                                          • jjjay
                                                                                                                                                            Registered User
                                                                                                                                                            • Jun 2005
                                                                                                                                                            • 1813
                                                                                                                                                            #89
                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Veterans Day
                                                                                                                                                            My indian friend does 3-5k a day with 1 subway. LOCATION
                                                                                                                                                            what's the net?

                                                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                                                              • jjjay
                                                                                                                                                                Registered User
                                                                                                                                                                • Jun 2005
                                                                                                                                                                • 1813
                                                                                                                                                                #90
                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by Veterans Day
                                                                                                                                                                another one who has no idea of how indians work. Straight fucking pakistani indians, hes making a killing
                                                                                                                                                                what the fuck is a pakistani indian? they're two different countries. sounds like you don't know your "friend" that well...

                                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                                  • jjjay
                                                                                                                                                                    Registered User
                                                                                                                                                                    • Jun 2005
                                                                                                                                                                    • 1813
                                                                                                                                                                    #91
                                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Veterans Day
                                                                                                                                                                    stereotypes exist for one reason or another, alot of the times they fit the bill. Denying indians are cheapasses is just silly. Cheers
                                                                                                                                                                    I stereotype you as an idiot.

                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                      • Za Ha
                                                                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                        • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                                        • 5112
                                                                                                                                                                        #92
                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by GuerillaGRRL
                                                                                                                                                                        Open up a Tim Hortons down there and rock their socks off!!!
                                                                                                                                                                        Applied and got rejected in the GTA area

                                                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                                                          • Napolean
                                                                                                                                                                            Misanthropic Egalitarian
                                                                                                                                                                            • Nov 2002
                                                                                                                                                                            • 4330
                                                                                                                                                                            #93
                                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by detoxed
                                                                                                                                                                            In high school my friend (a hot chick) had a family member who owend a dominos they seemed to have a lot of money.
                                                                                                                                                                            You actually have to work for Domino's for a number of years as a fulltime manager before you can become a franchisee
                                                                                                                                                                            HAH! FOUND IT FRIS

                                                                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                                                                              • MrJackMeHoff
                                                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                • Mar 2004
                                                                                                                                                                                • 4569
                                                                                                                                                                                #94
                                                                                                                                                                                restaurants are small profit margin high traffic needed.. Fuck that shit.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                  • Rhesus
                                                                                                                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                    • Aug 2004
                                                                                                                                                                                    • 2009
                                                                                                                                                                                    #95
                                                                                                                                                                                    For locations within Europe (not sure about the market and its maturity in US) I would suggest starting a Wok resto like http://www.noodlebox.com.au

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                                                                                                                                                                                        • Nov 2003
                                                                                                                                                                                        • 32189
                                                                                                                                                                                        #96
                                                                                                                                                                                        Like any other business... INTENSE research is key or else you might fail.

                                                                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                          • hershie
                                                                                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                            • Jun 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                            • 4642
                                                                                                                                                                                            #97
                                                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by MrJackMeHoff
                                                                                                                                                                                            restaurants are small profit margin high traffic needed.. Fuck that shit.
                                                                                                                                                                                            My experience leads me to completely agree. The food industry is also a highly stressful place to work, with all the time constraints to produce product, dangerous equipment, worries of food quality and especially cleanliness and food safety, all the team work needed with stressed out co-workers, long bad hours, dealings with the public. When you are a manager/owner there are of course zillions more crap piled on all that.

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                                                                                                                                                                                              • hershie
                                                                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                                • Jun 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                                • 4642
                                                                                                                                                                                                #98
                                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by Napolean
                                                                                                                                                                                                You actually have to work for Domino's for a number of years as a fulltime manager before you can become a franchisee
                                                                                                                                                                                                I was the manager of one of the busiest Pizza Hut's in North America when I lived in Toronto. Constant craziness but wow impressive volume.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                  • Meloman
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • Jul 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • 1540
                                                                                                                                                                                                    #99
                                                                                                                                                                                                    I had a friend in High School who's parents owned several subways. They were pretty well off. Before I got into online porn I did some basic research on subway franchises. If my memory serves me correct, each subway usually makes $10-30K net yearly. So ya you need several before you're making decent money. So what happens when you can find 2 good locations but can't find a 3rd? You can easily be stuck owning a few, working full time and still only make $30K. They aren't like a simply winning lottery ticket. It takes time and hard work.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Location does play a HUGE part in any store/restaurant etc.. But keep in mind that a great location not only will get u more sales BUT the rent will also be a lot higher as well.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Basically there's a ton of factors that go into running any franchise and they are anything but easy. Be prepared to work very hard, put in lots of hours and still have no guarantee of success.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    P.S. Yes there are exceptions to everything and I'm sure there are people that get lucky with the perfect great location, perfect rent etc.. and can make a boatload off 1 or 2 locations.
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Last edited by Meloman; 01-07-2006, 03:07 PM.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                        • Nov 2003
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • 32189
                                                                                                                                                                                                        #100
                                                                                                                                                                                                        It also helps to know the demographics of the area and their tastes.

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