And they say shaving is a myth - GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum

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Brad Mitchell

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#31

12-03-2002, 01:50 PM

Shaving is unethical, obviously, and anyone that does it should be hung in public. I have my own affiliate program, SinTalk, and through the ups and downs I've never once even been tempted. There must be some other sponsors out there like me, I don't believe they're ALL crooks.

Brad

President at MojoHost | brad at mojohost dot com | Skype MojoHostBrad
71 industry awards for hosting and professional excellence since 1999
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Kimmykim

bitchslapping zebras!!!!!

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#32

12-03-2002, 04:04 PM

Originally posted by Brujah
Fabian wrote JB: "Will try to read those boards... don't have the time for it ;-(

"We do 'shave' some .. no other way to keep it profitable .. will come up with some new tricks to give more back to the webmasters."

So, JB didn't know that CEN shaves, and Fabian had to tell him ?

OMG that is fucking funny!
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kenny

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#33

12-03-2002, 04:14 PM

Originally posted by SleazyDream

I 'd have to agree with this - shaving is FRAUD and anyone caught doing it should be subject to the same criminal proceedings as financial fraud in banking or the stock market.

I agree, sad enough instead of being punished they are left alone to take advantage of the next unknowing webmaster.
They can make up all the competition and everyone else is doing it excuses they want but it is still stealing.

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kenny

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#34

12-03-2002, 04:17 PM

And fuck all that paying out to much persignup got make it up somewhere dumb shit. If a program cant honestly profit and pay $35 persignup then dont do it

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DTK

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#35

12-03-2002, 04:46 PM

Originally posted by SleazyDream

I 'd have to agree with this - shaving is FRAUD and anyone caught doing it should be subject to the same criminal proceedings as financial fraud in banking or the stock market.

Nah, they should just have "cheater" shouted at them a couple times and then back to business as usual. That's how it works in this business....

Arguing whether the Democratic or Republican party is better is like debating which steaming pile of shit is slightly less stinky.
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Fletch XXX

GFY HALL OF FAME DAMMIT!!!

Join Date: Jan 2002

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#36

12-03-2002, 04:47 PM

'The final swing is not a drill.'

Want an Android App for your tube, membership, or free site?

Need banners or promo material? Hit us up (ICQ Fletch: 148841377) or email me fletchxxx at gmail.com - recent work - About me
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WiredGuy

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Join Date: Aug 2002

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#37

12-03-2002, 04:51 PM

Basic rule of business: Send traffic to achieve maximum profit

So, if sending your traffic to one sponsor makes you more money than another sponsor, who cares if they shave. Sure, it isn't ethical that they are cutting out some of your profits, but lets face it, this is a cut throat business with margins that are getting thinner every day. The only point that should really matter is the amount you got paid divided by amount of hits sent. I honestly don't care if someone shaves my account, so long as I make the most money with that company.

WG

I play with Google.
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DTK

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#38

12-03-2002, 04:55 PM

Originally posted by WiredGuy
I honestly don't care if someone shaves my account, so long as I make the most money with that company.

WG

I understand what you're getting at, but really your statement seems to condone fraud and last time I checked, fraud is a felony.

Arguing whether the Democratic or Republican party is better is like debating which steaming pile of shit is slightly less stinky.
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BV

wtf

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#39

12-03-2002, 04:57 PM

Originally posted by SykkBoy2

do you want every cent that your traffic was WORTH? or what the program offered to pay?

if you want to be paid what your traffic is WORTH, go with a revshare program ;)

I can agree with that but it is also very possible to be shaved on a 3rd party revshare program several different ways, and on CCBILL it's possible with a click of a button!

I still think it's safe to say you have a higher chance of being shaved by a big program paying out insanely huge per sign amounts. For Christ sakes, you would almost have to be retarded to believe you would not be.......

......and if by chance you are not shaved and these sponsors are able to make up for these BIG payouts by cross sells and using hard to understand TOS, and other tactics designed to fuck the surfer, then that surfer will likely never buy another membership ever again any fucking where! Anyone with any business sense knows it's all about your repeat business in most any industry.

that's just my opinion, take it for what it's worth:

Cheers,
BV
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WiredGuy

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#40

12-03-2002, 05:49 PM

Originally posted by DTK

I understand what you're getting at, but really your statement seems to condone fraud and last time I checked, fraud is a felony.

While I do agree that shaving basically boils down to fraud I also understand the necessity to doing it to remain competitive. It's all part of the business equation, paying $35, $40, $45, whatever per $2.95 signup is very difficult if those surfers don't recur. So I can understand when a company feels the necessity to shave certain accounts. I'm not saying it's right or justified, I'm just saying I can understand why its being done...

WG

I play with Google.
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FlyingIguana

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#41

12-03-2002, 05:55 PM

Originally posted by Brujah
Yet, if everyone is shaving.. then its all just marketing hype and gimmicks. There was a poll somewhere, here maybe .. awhile back asking the question;

If your sponsor was shaving, but your paycheck at the end of the week was bigger than the other sponsors.. would it matter to you?

i'd much rather the sponsor just be honest about sign ups and pay less per. at the end of the day it would be the same amount pretty much, except you can sleep at night knowing you're not dealing with people who steal your traffic. thats pretty much what it comes down to. just because they offer you more per sign up, doesn't give them a right to shave.
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NiteRain

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#42

12-03-2002, 05:59 PM

I kind of agree that you won't get every cent your traffic is worth. For example, per signup you are missing out on the recurring, and for rev share you are lucky if you make the same or more, depending on the retention of the site. But I would rather that the sponsor be honest with their dealings with me.

AIM: PerlScriptor
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FlyingIguana

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#43

12-03-2002, 06:00 PM

Originally posted by sextoyking
Krl,

yep in the early 90's we ran a large adult bbs in portland.

used to sell tons of adult cdroms, and spammed in compuserve classifieds alot)

nice to meet ya.

todd

how much money was there to be made online around that time ? i didn't get on the net till like 95

Last edited by FlyingIguana; 12-03-2002, 06:02 PM.
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Kimmykim

bitchslapping zebras!!!!!

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#44

12-03-2002, 06:11 PM

Originally posted by FlyingIguana

i'd much rather the sponsor just be honest about sign ups and pay less per. at the end of the day it would be the same amount pretty much, except you can sleep at night knowing you're not dealing with people who steal your traffic. thats pretty much what it comes down to. just because they offer you more per sign up, doesn't give them a right to shave.

Funny, you say that, but the traffic is what talks. Someone throws up a $70 payout or a $75 day and everyone's traffic moves in that direction.

Resellers don't send traffic to recurring for the most part, they don't send traffic to $25 per join programs, they DO send their traffic to the best converting or the highest payout, regardless of the amounts on the checks from any of them...
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FlyingIguana

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#45

12-03-2002, 06:21 PM

Originally posted by Kimmykim

Funny, you say that, but the traffic is what talks. Someone throws up a $70 payout or a $75 day and everyone's traffic moves in that direction.

Resellers don't send traffic to recurring for the most part, they don't send traffic to $25 per join programs, they DO send their traffic to the best converting or the highest payout, regardless of the amounts on the checks from any of them...

if i see a program offering like 60 bux per and they have a basic cookie cutter site and members area filled with plug in content, its obvious they're shaving and i look elsewhere.

i'm sure a lot of noobs will be drooling at all the money they'll make on that same program, then wonder where all the money is when they 500 hits a month don't get any sign ups.
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