I think this 2257 shitstorm is going to be bigger than most assume. - GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum

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chadglni

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#1

I think this 2257 shitstorm is going to be bigger than most assume.

05-31-2005, 07:10 AM

And here is why I think that.

1. So far we've heard from very few programs that expect or already have their shit in order.

2. Not a peep out of webcam sites as to how they will or even if they can comply. For those that missed it, an article was posted that stated for a cam site to be compliant they would have to record every webcam stream that went through their system and save it for 7 years.

3. Haven't heard from most TGP owners about submitting with non hardcore thumbs. If they wait until the last day their archives will be non compliant.

4. I doubt the majority of webmasters with millions of pics on thousands of old galleries will just delete all files from their server and start over. I'm sure quite a few will just "risk it".

5. Everyone is all hot and bothered about an injunction. I don't think that most people are clear on the fact that even with an injunction they will still be breaking current laws. Therefore if the injunction is lifted at any time they could be prosecuted for breaking the law while the injunction was in place.

6. Not all of the new regulations go into effect on June 23rd. Everyone keeps using this as a deadline but that's only one the worst part of the regulations that take effect on that day. There are still many other parts that are law right now from what I understand. (Please correct me if I'm wrong)

7. Too many people here running around without a clue in the world.

8. The government has done some "sweep" type of arrests lately where they go after thousands of people at once. It will only take 1 of these sweeps about 2257 non compliance to cause widespread panic and chaos.

There are other reasons but I'll leave it at that. Your thoughts?

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#2

05-31-2005, 07:12 AM

Originally posted by chadglni

And here is why I think that.

Too many people here running around without a clue in the world.

So very true.

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Major (Tom)

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#3

05-31-2005, 07:12 AM

I honestly think it will change things for sure. I conjecture that the mid sized programs will be the ones to come out on top because of this.

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TheSenator

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#4

05-31-2005, 07:14 AM

Don't come to GFY for 2257 advice. Go to a lawyer.

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bigdog

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#5

05-31-2005, 07:15 AM

i think most people are playing the waiting game to see what everyone else does
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mardigras

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#6

05-31-2005, 07:15 AM

I predict the biggest thing will be more porn for the kiddies via P2P...

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#7

05-31-2005, 07:15 AM

It's either going to be a slaughter or it will die down if an injunction is issued and the DOJ awaits the resolution from that injunction, which could take a couple of years.
The problem with the injunction is that most webmasters will just forget about it and will not comply, therefore running the risk of waking up to a very dark reality when the law finally takes effect in its final form

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chadglni

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#8

05-31-2005, 07:16 AM

Originally posted by DukeSkywalker

I honestly think it will change things for sure. I conjecture that the mid sized programs will be the ones to come out on top because of this.

Duke

I think anyone with their shit together will come out on top. You know how the sheep can be, the first sign of any trouble and they will be flocking to anybody that can offer them a sense of security. It is a little annoying to not hear from your sponsors though. For instance, has 1 webcam site even mentioned that they are compliant? I don't need documents from them as I use non nude images but if they aren't compliant that means my income is at constant risk. Not cool.

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tony286

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#9

05-31-2005, 07:18 AM

I dont think they will do sweep arrests , they already painted themselves into a corner saying its to protect children. So your going to arrest a 1000 people with no children on their sites but paperwork errors.
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chadglni

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#10

05-31-2005, 07:19 AM

Originally posted by PussyMan

It's either going to be a slaughter or it will die down if an injunction is issued and the DOJ awaits the resolution from that injunction, which could take a couple of years.
The problem with the injunction is that most webmasters will just forget about it and will not comply, therefore running the risk of waking up to a very dark reality when the law finally takes effect in its final form

That's what I mean. Even if an injunction happened today, you are still breaking the law by not complying with it. As soon as the injunction is lifted they could prosecute everyone who waited to see what happened. I'm sure "some" of it will be shot down after all is said and done but it's highly unlikely all of it will.

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chadglni

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#11

05-31-2005, 07:21 AM

Originally posted by tony404

I dont think they will do sweep arrests , they already painted themselves into a corner saying its to protect children. So your going to arrest a 1000 people with no children on their sites but paperwork errors.

Paperwork errors? That is assuming everyone even has paperwork. It's very simple for them to spin it as protecting kids because obviously if you don't have your paperwork in order you can't be making sure there are no kids on your sites. That reason would be very widely accepted by the mainstream and would only take CNN one day to pain the 1000 people as degenerates that did nothing to protect kids in porn.

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#12

05-31-2005, 07:22 AM

Originally posted by bigdog

i think most people are playing the waiting game to see what everyone else does

Thats what everyone is saying to me... lets wait and see... Im not sure its the right thing to do. And with all the different threads and opinions, Im sure many people are as confused as I am. One thing we keep seeing over and over is .. Dont ask GFY for advice .. this is so true. I think everyone has to watch out for himself or herself. If you have questions, call a lawyer.

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#13

05-31-2005, 07:22 AM

I think many webmasters dont have a clue whats going on, because they dont visit adult webmaster boards or read it all, and only few sponsors has sent out info about it.
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chadglni

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#14

05-31-2005, 07:29 AM

§ 75.2 Maintenance of records.

(a) Any producer of any book,
magazine, periodical, film, videotape,
digitally- or computer-manipulated
image, digital image, picture, or other
matter that contains a depiction of an
actual human being engaged in actual
sexually explicit conduct that is
produced in whole or in part with
materials that have been mailed or
shipped in interstate or foreign
commerce, or is shipped or transported
or is intended for shipment or
transportation in interstate or foreign
commerce and that contains one or
more visual depictions of an actual
human being engaged in actual sexually
explicit conduct made after July 3, 1995
shall, for each performer portrayed in
such visual depiction, create and
maintain records containing the
following:
(1) The legal name and date of birth
of each performer, obtained by the
producer?s examination of a picture
identification card. For any performer
portrayed in such a depiction made after
July 3, 1995, the records shall also
include a legible copy of the
identification document examined and,
if that document does not contain a
recent and recognizable picture of the
performer, a legible copy of a picture
identification card.

From my understanding this is already law. That means everyone without an ID for content made after 1995 are CURRENTLY breaking the law. June 23 deadline is for the expanded requirements.

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#15

05-31-2005, 07:31 AM

Originally posted by tony404

I dont think they will do sweep arrests , they already painted themselves into a corner saying its to protect children. So your going to arrest a 1000 people with no children on their sites but paperwork errors.

sorry - politically this comes with ZERO risk to Bush - NOBODY cares about the rights of pornographers, not even in a 'free speech' context really, except for the ACLU and FSC. So they can do a sweep and charge 1000 porn webmasters, throw 1000 porn webmasters in jail and nobody will care a whit - the government has been very clever about this, they are waging a war against pornography under the guise of a war against 'child pornography'. Ever notice how mainstream media always
uses the terms 'Internet porn' and 'child porn' interchangeably?

Like everybody else I have no idea how big this crackdown on 2257 is going to be BUT to dismiss the very real possibility that there will be a large scale sweep is just whistling past the graveyard in my opinion. it's a very real possibility.

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#16

05-31-2005, 07:35 AM

We believe this will be the MAJOR shake up to the industry this year.
We have fielded over 30 calls this weekend on this matter.

Understand that this law has A LOT of bite and very little risk for the Goverment. Even if it is beaten in the courts they will have had their headlines and glory on TV.
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#17

05-31-2005, 07:38 AM

here we go again, do you people invision 10,000 DOJ soldiers waiting to swoop in like they do on inner city crack houses? LOL! I forsee nothing but a bunch of hype Oh ya non-nude and text 0wnz

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chadglni

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#18

05-31-2005, 07:40 AM

http://www.avn.com/index.php?Primary...tent_ID=227704

For reference that all of the law doesn't go into effect in June and that some of it is enforcable now.

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#19

05-31-2005, 07:43 AM

At least it'll be a minimum security federal prison. They're not too bad.

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chadglni

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#20

05-31-2005, 07:47 AM

Originally posted by Veterans Day

here we go again, do you people invision 10,000 DOJ soldiers waiting to swoop in like they do on inner city crack houses? LOL! I forsee nothing but a bunch of hype Oh ya non-nude and text 0wnz

Just how many US based webmasters to you think there are? You act like this is some big ordeal that's hard to enforce but you are wrong.

DOJ calls "big ass sponsor a". Hi "big ass sponsor a", did you send out the documentation to all of your affiliates where they can comply. Sponsor a says "No, we feel that this would be a threat to our models security". DOJ: "Ok, thank you".

Now every image or video the DOJ finds from that site on an American affiliates pages is breaking the law. A few whois searches later they have a list of people to arrest.

Just 1 example. I know I could personally round up 1000 people a year if it was my job. The DOJ doesn't need 10,000 agents, they only need a handful and you can believe they have em ready.

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#21

05-31-2005, 07:48 AM

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mardigras

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#22

05-31-2005, 07:51 AM

Originally posted by escorpio

At least it'll be a minimum security federal prison. They're not too bad.

If I don't have satellite and DSL, that's BAD!

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#23

05-31-2005, 07:59 AM

Originally posted by tony404

I dont think they will do sweep arrests , they already painted themselves into a corner saying its to protect children. So your going to arrest a 1000 people with no children on their sites but paperwork errors.

Exactly, they can do it if they want, but it probably wouldn't hold up in court as the intent of the law is to protect children from being exploited. Not to prosecute webmasters for paperwork violations.

I still think this will be used mainly as a tool to go after targets they already have for obscenity charges. Such as extreme assocs for example.. They lost that case on obscenity,but with this new law, they could have probably nailed him on some sort of 2257 violation.

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#24

05-31-2005, 08:03 AM

all vouyer sites will be closed.. if not, then they are fake

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mardigras

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#25

05-31-2005, 08:06 AM

Originally posted by crockett

Exactly, they can do it if they want, but it probably wouldn't hold up in court as the intent of the law is to protect children from being exploited. Not to prosecute webmasters for paperwork violations.

I still think this will be used mainly as a tool to go after targets they already have for obscenity charges. Such as extreme assocs for example.. They lost that case on obscenity,but with this new law, they could have probably nailed him on some sort of 2257 violation.

I agree with that to an extent. I think for at least any early government activity it will be used to prosecute "high profile" cases... but I do think there will be some "activist" types that will be very busy with their new tool too.

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#26

05-31-2005, 08:10 AM

I am not worried about 2257 much myself.. change brings opportunity.
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#27

05-31-2005, 08:12 AM

Originally posted by my2257

We believe this will be the MAJOR shake up to the industry this year.
We have fielded over 30 calls this weekend on this matter.

Understand that this law has A LOT of bite and very little risk for the Goverment. Even if it is beaten in the courts they will have had their headlines and glory on TV.

Using scare tactics to sell your "product"? BTW, there is already a free version very similar floating around that many people are using.

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#28

05-31-2005, 08:26 AM

Originally posted by tony404

I dont think they will do sweep arrests , they already painted themselves into a corner saying its to protect children. So your going to arrest a 1000 people with no children on their sites but paperwork errors.

There will be arrests..maybe not "sweep arrests."

This smacks of the 80's and something I've been mentioning on this board since the very first year I started posting on it.

They will not be able to get people on obscenity so they will go after the money.

How? In a variety of ways, and this is just one of them.

In the 80's after the Meese commission's report was released many cities around the country started to enact new zoning laws making things more difficult for adult businesses from peep show arcades to strip clubs.

They then used these new zoning laws to bully them, keep them in court all the time constantly battling draining smaller businesses' pocket books.

This was very effective. For example in Dallas there was a section around Harry Hines Blvd that I used to call Sin City or Sin City Row...there were entire shopping centers that were nothing but adult related businesses.

Video stores, lingerie / toy shops, massage parlors. When it was all said and done on one corner where there was no less than 8 businesses only 1 still stands.

In Fort Worth you couldn't find any adult videos until Clinton was electedinto office.

There will be a great culling of american webmasters / programs...watch and see.

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#29

05-31-2005, 08:26 AM

Originally posted by BradShaw

Using scare tactics to sell your "product"? BTW, there is already a free version very similar floating around that many people are using.

Where is the link to download the free one?

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#30

05-31-2005, 09:12 AM

webcam sites and teen type sites will just weed out the hardcore material...
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chadglni

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#31

05-31-2005, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by stev0

webcam sites and teen type sites will just weed out the hardcore material...

You think webcam sites will stop letting people get naked on cam? lol

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