New 2257 regs published (link here)

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  • NickPapageorgio
    Confirmed User
    • Apr 2004
    • 8323
    #151
    Originally posted by GatorB
    explain this to me

    Sec. 75.7 Exemption statement.

    (a) Any producer of any book, magazine, periodical, film,
    videotape, digitally- or computer-manipulated image, digital image,
    picture, or other matter may cause to be affixed to every copy of the
    matter a statement attesting that the matter is not covered by the
    record-keeping requirements of 18 U.S.C. 2257(a)-(c) and of this part
    if:
    (1) The matter contains only visual depictions of actual sexually
    explicit conduct made before July 3, 1995, or is produced,
    manufactured, published, duplicated, reproduced, or reissued before
    July 3, 1995;
    (2) The matter contains only visual depictions of simulated
    sexually explicit conduct; or,
    (3) The matter contains only some combination of the visual
    depictions described in paragraphs (a)(1) and (a)(2) of this section.
    (b) If the primary producer and the secondary producer are
    different entities    , the primary producer may certify to the secondary
    producer that the visual depictions in the matter satisfy the standards
    under paragraphs (a)(1) through (a)(3) of this section. The secondary
    producer may then cause to be affixed to every copy of the matter a
    statement attesting that the matter is not covered by the record-
    keeping requirements of 18 U.S.C. 2257(a)-(c) and of this part.


    So if the primary producer tells me that the images don't have to comply with 2257 then I can take him at his word and put a statement on my site that says the images don't have to comply with 2257? And if the pimary producer is LYING about that????????

    It's pretty hazy I must say. The part that bothers me is where it states that "any model depicted in a manner that is considered sexually explicit..." bla bla bla. Who decides what is sexually explicit? I have seen pepsi commercials that could give me a hard on. Is that sexually explicit? Does the way a girl in a bikini stands constitute a sexually explicit type pose? And if so, even if she's not nude, but she is standing in a suggestive way, who decides if that's sexually explicit? Is it voted on? Is it up to some guy sitting in some office somewhere?

      Comment

      • clickhappy
        Confirmed User
        • Mar 2004
        • 4027
        #152
        Originally posted by swedguy
        (3) if the
        secondary producer satisfies the
        requirements of ยง 75.2(b), the address of
        the secondary producer.
        oh fuck.

          Comment

          • xxxdesign-net
            My hips don't lie
            • Nov 2002
            • 10129
            #153
            Originally posted by theking
            the purchasers of non US content cannot legally use their content...thus they would lose their market in the US.

            How is that.. Where is it written ?

            18yo Americans coming to Canada can buy beer you know.. US laws dont apply... If my site is on a foreign server and is administrated by a non-us citizen.. the american buying a membership is buying it on a canadian site..

              Comment

              • goBigtime
                Confirmed User
                • Nov 2002
                • 7761
                #154
                IMO, here is the regulation exemption adpoted for google:


                One commenter commented that the definition of a primary producer
                as anyone who ``digitizes an image'' could be read to include anyone
                who scans or digitizes a photograph or negative. The commenter
                suggested that someone who performs that activity should be exempted
                from the record-keeping requirements in the same way that photo
                processors are exempt under Sec. 75.1(c)(4)(i). The Department adopts
                this comment and has clarified in the final rule that someone who
                solely digitizes a pre-existing photograph or negative as part of a
                commercial enterprise and has no other commercial interest in the
                production, reproduction, sale, distribution, or other transfer of the
                sexually explicit depiction is exempt from the requirements of Sec.
                75. As reflected in the phrase ``has no other commercial interest in
                the production, reproduction, sale, distribution, or other transfer of
                the sexually explicit depiction,'' this definition is intended to apply
                to businesses that are analogous to photo processors in their lack of
                commercial interest in the sexually explicit material, and who are
                separate and distinct from the on-line distributors of pornography who
                digitize the covers of videos, DVDs, etc., who are included in the
                definition of secondary producer, as discussed above.


                Hmmmm after a second read, maybe not.
                Last edited by goBigtime; 05-24-2005, 06:48 AM.

                  Comment

                  • GatorB
                    The Demon & 12clicks
                    • Oct 2001
                    • 18208
                    #155
                    Originally posted by goBigtime
                    as far as I could tell, there was an exemption adpoted that would cover google cache.
                    Well aren't they special. Kind of like making law that says SOME people can rob banks everyone else does 20 years.

                      Comment

                      • Nate-MM2
                        So Fucking Banned
                        • Sep 2002
                        • 263
                        #156
                        Originally posted by swedguy
                        ยง 75.6 Statement describing location of
                        books and records.

                        (3) A street address at
                        which the records required by this part
                        may be made available. The street
                        address may be an address specified by
                        the primary producer or, if the
                        secondary producer satisfies the
                        requirements of ยง 75.2(b), the address of
                        the secondary producer. A post office
                        box address does not satisfy this
                        requirement.
                        This is a moot point when you consider that records need to be maintained for 5 years after dissolution.

                        You are risking jailtime if ANY of your content providers close up shop which wouldn't shock me in this type of business environment.

                        Being your own official Custodian of Records listed on your sites is the best option since you have to keep the records at your place of business anyways.

                          Comment

                          • Boss Traffic Jim
                            Confirmed User
                            • Nov 2002
                            • 1150
                            #157
                            Originally posted by pr0
                            I just changed my sig.....anyone interested, feel free to hit me up tomorrow
                            It does not matter where your servers are located, it's where you run you're business that matters.
                            Last edited by Boss Traffic Jim; 05-24-2005, 06:50 AM.

                              Comment

                              • Nate-MM2
                                So Fucking Banned
                                • Sep 2002
                                • 263
                                #158
                                Originally posted by xxxdesign-net
                                How is that.. Where is it written ?

                                18yo Americans coming to Canada can buy beer you know.. US laws dont apply... If my site is on a foreign server and is administrated by a non-us citizen.. the american buying a membership is buying it on a canadian site..

                                He was referring to US webmasters buying content as the 'market' not US surfers.

                                  Comment

                                  • ADL Colin
                                    Too lazy to set a custom title
                                    • Feb 2001
                                    • 11929
                                    #159
                                    Originally posted by GatorB
                                    I thought republicans were against government regualtion of businesses? They seem to want to delregulate every other business.
                                    Yeah, and Republicans are supposed to be in favor of smaller government too. The real-world doesn't really work that way.

                                    I'm not arguing "Republican vs. Democrat". Whether it is the environmental crusade of Democrats or the religious crusade of Republicans the effect on business is the same. Political beliefs change the business landscape through regulations, regulations which have the intention - from a particular point of view - of protecting someone (from pollution, from porn, from bad accounting).

                                    Pornographers worry about Republican regulations just like miners worry about Democratic regulations. It's part of the cost of business. What can one do? Like I learned in boy scouts, "be prepared".


                                    Adult Date Link - $50 PPS starting NOW! -- good and JUICY!

                                    skype = "adultdatelink"

                                      Comment

                                      • GatorB
                                        The Demon & 12clicks
                                        • Oct 2001
                                        • 18208
                                        #160
                                        Anyone have a script that blocks out all US ip adresses? Redirect US traffic to a page that explains how Bush fucked up their access to porn.

                                          Comment

                                          • Trixxxia
                                            Confirmed User
                                            • Aug 2004
                                            • 5600
                                            #161
                                            Originally posted by xxxdesign-net
                                            Uh... we do NOT sell IN the US market.. I dont ship DVDs there... Americans who buy memberships comes to ME.. NOt the other way around..
                                            Just to clarify - that portion was for content producers from a foreign country that think they don't have to comply. The foreign producers have to comply if they are selling to anyone in the US or anyone whose company is registered in the US for billing purposes (even if they aren't in it - which in theory they should be).

                                              Comment

                                              • goBigtime
                                                Confirmed User
                                                • Nov 2002
                                                • 7761
                                                #162
                                                Originally posted by GatorB
                                                Well aren't they special. Kind of like making law that says SOME people can rob banks everyone else does 20 years.
                                                Actually after second read, that section only covered pre existing photgraphs or negatives.

                                                  Comment

                                                  • directfiesta
                                                    Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                    • Oct 2002
                                                    • 30198
                                                    #163
                                                    what a mess
                                                    I know that Asspimple is stoopid ... As he says, it is a FACT !

                                                    But I can't figure out how he can breathe or type , at the same time ....

                                                      Comment

                                                      • directfiesta
                                                        Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                        • Oct 2002
                                                        • 30198
                                                        #164
                                                        Originally posted by xxxdesign-net
                                                        the american buying a membership is buying it on a canadian site..
                                                        And that is backed up by none other than REVENUE CANADA ( GST implementation ) .
                                                        I know that Asspimple is stoopid ... As he says, it is a FACT !

                                                        But I can't figure out how he can breathe or type , at the same time ....

                                                          Comment

                                                          • MrChips
                                                            Confirmed User
                                                            • May 2005
                                                            • 1504
                                                            #165
                                                            Explicit and Actual

                                                            In the following section, point a2 suggests to me that full female nudity, and the publishing thereof by either a primary or secondary producer is exempt.

                                                            For example, if I have actually uploaded a gallery which contains ONLY a nude female posing and not sticking a dildo in her hole, then the gallery cannot even be described as simulated wanking?

                                                            - LOL - I had to laugh.

                                                            Ok, it has to stand true then - that the definition of "sexually explicit" has not been defined.

                                                            Is a pair of tits explicit? Is a fanny shot explicit? Is the fanny shot explicit - but youre ok cos its a "simulated fanny" shot - due to the fact it aint got a cock in it?

                                                            Whats explicit? Is posing with her arse in the air - alone - engaging in sexually explicit conduct? If not - then solo nowanks are fine yes?

                                                            This means that a large majority of banners are exempt - and also means - that as a tgp gallery poster - you may be able to get away with tit and fanny shots - which would be good for sales cos the hardcore stuff along with the documents is at the sponsor.

                                                            This is just my interpretation - do you guys think its a reasonable one?

                                                            For example again - one could perfectly legally - without maintaining documents, either as a primary or secondary producer - totally naked galleries of couples just pretending.

                                                            And if you can do that cos is simulated then FULL NUDITY AND LEG SPREADING ASS SHOTS are surely exempt if the woman is alone????

                                                            Any thoughts guys and girls?









                                                            Sec. 75.7 Exemption statement.

                                                            (a) Any producer of any book, magazine, periodical, film,
                                                            videotape, digitally- or computer-manipulated image, digital image,
                                                            picture, or other matter may cause to be affixed to every copy of the
                                                            matter a statement attesting that the matter is not covered by the
                                                            record-keeping requirements of 18 U.S.C. 2257(a)-(c) and of this part
                                                            if:
                                                            (1) The matter contains only visual depictions of actual sexually
                                                            explicit conduct made before July 3, 1995, or is produced,
                                                            manufactured, published, duplicated, reproduced, or reissued before
                                                            July 3, 1995;
                                                            (2) The matter contains only visual depictions of simulated
                                                            sexually explicit conduct; or,
                                                            (3) The matter contains only some combination of the visual
                                                            depictions described in paragraphs (a)(1) and (a)(2) of this section.
                                                            (b) If the primary producer and the secondary producer are
                                                            different entities, the primary producer may certify to the secondary
                                                            producer that the visual depictions in the matter satisfy the standards
                                                            under paragraphs (a)(1) through (a)(3) of this section. The secondary
                                                            producer may then cause to be affixed to every copy of the matter a
                                                            statement attesting that the matter is not covered by the record-
                                                            keeping requirements of 18 U.S.C. 2257(a)-(c) and of this part.

                                                              Comment

                                                              • ddfGandalf
                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                • Feb 2005
                                                                • 534
                                                                #166
                                                                Hey,

                                                                By any chance someone has a french version?
                                                                Thanks

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • Nightwind
                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                    • May 2005
                                                                    • 4786
                                                                    #167
                                                                    Originally posted by MrChips
                                                                    In the following section, point a2 suggests to me that full female nudity, and the publishing thereof by either a primary or secondary producer is exempt.

                                                                    For example, if I have actually uploaded a gallery which contains ONLY a nude female posing and not sticking a dildo in her hole, then the gallery cannot even be described as simulated wanking?

                                                                    - LOL - I had to laugh.

                                                                    Ok, it has to stand true then - that the definition of "sexually explicit" has not been defined.

                                                                    Is a pair of tits explicit? Is a fanny shot explicit? Is the fanny shot explicit - but youre ok cos its a "simulated fanny" shot - due to the fact it aint got a cock in it?

                                                                    Whats explicit? Is posing with her arse in the air - alone - engaging in sexually explicit conduct? If not - then solo nowanks are fine yes?

                                                                    This means that a large majority of banners are exempt - and also means - that as a tgp gallery poster - you may be able to get away with tit and fanny shots - which would be good for sales cos the hardcore stuff along with the documents is at the sponsor.

                                                                    This is just my interpretation - do you guys think its a reasonable one?

                                                                    For example again - one could perfectly legally - without maintaining documents, either as a primary or secondary producer - totally naked galleries of couples just pretending.

                                                                    And if you can do that cos is simulated then FULL NUDITY AND LEG SPREADING ASS SHOTS are surely exempt if the woman is alone????

                                                                    Any thoughts guys and girls?

                                                                    That's what i was thinking and would also like to know.

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • basschick
                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                        • Jan 2001
                                                                        • 2540
                                                                        #168
                                                                        i'm pretty sure that sexually explicit has been defined - it is not being redefined in 2257.

                                                                        two lawyers explained to me that nudity is not sexually explicit IF there is no showing of genitals or anus, and there is no spreading of legs in a lacsivious manner. i suspect pinching nipples is also sexually explicit, or anything that looks like you would do it to incite lust, if ya see what i mean.

                                                                        did you check this part out?

                                                                        "(b) Picture identification card means a document issued by the
                                                                        United States, a State government or a political subdivision thereof,
                                                                        or a United States territory, that bears the photograph and the name of
                                                                        the individual identified, and provides sufficient specific information
                                                                        that it can be accessed from the issuing authority, such as a passport,
                                                                        Permanent Resident Card (commonly known as a ``Green Card''), or other
                                                                        employment authorization document issued by the United States, a
                                                                        driver's license issued by a State or the District of Columbia, or
                                                                        another form of identification issued by a State or the District of
                                                                        Columbia; or, a foreign government-issued equivalent of any of the
                                                                        documents listed above when both the person who is the subject of the
                                                                        picture identification card and the producer maintaining the required
                                                                        records are located outside the United States.                                                                        "

                                                                        it appears to me - but i'm not a lawyer - that only if the model AND the producer are located outside the u.s. can foreign i.d. be used. of course, it doesn't say "only"... any thoughts?
                                                                        Last edited by basschick; 05-24-2005, 07:15 AM.
                                                                        Got Gay and For Women Traffic?

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • directfiesta
                                                                            Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                            • Oct 2002
                                                                            • 30198
                                                                            #169
                                                                            Originally posted by ddfGandalf
                                                                            Hey,

                                                                            By any chance someone has a french version?
                                                                            Thanks

                                                                            Why in hell would the US have a FRENCH version ???

                                                                            If they do a translation, it will be to spanish first ....

                                                                            But you can always put all that mumbo-jimbo in babelfish: the outcome could be funny ....
                                                                            I know that Asspimple is stoopid ... As he says, it is a FACT !

                                                                            But I can't figure out how he can breathe or type , at the same time ....

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • Snake Doctor
                                                                                I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                • Mar 2001
                                                                                • 13449
                                                                                #170
                                                                                Originally posted by Nightwind
                                                                                That's what i was thinking and would also like to know.
                                                                                *sigh*

                                                                                The law defines what sexually explicit is....they were even nice enough to tell you in the regulations what portion of 18 USC section 2257 the definition was in.
                                                                                sig too big

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • xxxjay
                                                                                    Tube groupie.
                                                                                    • Aug 2002
                                                                                    • 13482
                                                                                    #171
                                                                                    I would just try to remain calm and wait for the injunction. It will come.
                                                                                    http://donttellmehowtoruinmylife.com/ - http://www.jmdigitalmarketing.com/my...s-and-reviews/ - http://www.wouldyouhitit.org - http://shinyobjectreviews.com/

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      • Snake Doctor
                                                                                        I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                        • Mar 2001
                                                                                        • 13449
                                                                                        #172
                                                                                        Originally posted by xxxjay
                                                                                        I would just try to remain calm and wait for the injunction. It will come.
                                                                                        SShhhhhh.......I'm trying to beat the NATS error thread for longest of the week
                                                                                        sig too big

                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                          • Doc911
                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                            • Feb 2004
                                                                                            • 3695
                                                                                            #173
                                                                                            whats the matter with the matter thats attatched to the matter of the subject matter?


                                                                                            For PHP/MySQL scripts ICQ 161480555 or email [email protected]

                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                              • directfiesta
                                                                                                Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                • Oct 2002
                                                                                                • 30198
                                                                                                #174
                                                                                                Originally posted by Doc911
                                                                                                whats the matter with the matter thats attatched to the matter of the subject matter?
                                                                                                It doesn't really matter
                                                                                                I know that Asspimple is stoopid ... As he says, it is a FACT !

                                                                                                But I can't figure out how he can breathe or type , at the same time ....

                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                  • latinasojourn
                                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                                    • Oct 2003
                                                                                                    • 3191
                                                                                                    #175
                                                                                                    Originally posted by swedguy
                                                                                                    Alright, here's the important parts:
                                                                                                    this is more reasonable and better than i thought.

                                                                                                    it is doable.

                                                                                                    and will separate the wheat from the chaff.

                                                                                                    frankly, i breathe easier. piece of cake if you are a primary producer.

                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                      • RawAlex
                                                                                                        So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                        • Oct 2003
                                                                                                        • 9465
                                                                                                        #176
                                                                                                        Here is a few highlights:

                                                                                                        First off, third part custodian of record keepers are now SPECIFICALLY BANNED. You can not longer use a third party to store your materials, they must be at your place of business and your place of business MUST BE DEFINED BE REAL ADDRESS.

                                                                                                        Second, as it appears they define model release by photoshoot or video taping (allowing one model release per session) it would appear that all of the images produced during that session are legally locked together. Thus, a softcore head and shoulder shot in a series of hardcore fucking images could be construed as a hardcore image as it is part of a single 2257 document. It is not clear that the head and shoulder shot could be used on a thumbtgp, example, and linked to hardcore material without there being an issue.

                                                                                                        On the question of what is sexuallty explicit, the law has been there for a long time:

                                                                                                        2256. Definitions for chapter

                                                                                                        Release date: 2004-08-06

                                                                                                        For the purposes of this chapter, the term?
                                                                                                        (1) ?minor? means any person under the age of eighteen years;
                                                                                                        (2) ?sexually explicit conduct? means actual or simulated?
                                                                                                        (A) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex;
                                                                                                        (B) bestiality;
                                                                                                        (C) masturbation;
                                                                                                        (D) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or
                                                                                                        (E) lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person;
                                                                                                        Thus, any spreads, or even shots that show the genital area could be considered sexually explicit.

                                                                                                        If you operate a thumbtgp, I would suggest you start looking for an alternative starting June 23rd, 2005.

                                                                                                        Alex

                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                          • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                            I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                            • Mar 2001
                                                                                                            • 13449
                                                                                                            #177
                                                                                                            Originally posted by Doc911
                                                                                                            whats the matter with the matter thats attatched to the matter of the subject matter?
                                                                                                            D) None of the above
                                                                                                            sig too big

                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                              • xxxjay
                                                                                                                Tube groupie.
                                                                                                                • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                • 13482
                                                                                                                #178
                                                                                                                Originally posted by Lenny2
                                                                                                                SShhhhhh.......I'm trying to beat the NATS error thread for longest of the week
                                                                                                                This one should, and deserves to beat that for a while. In the meantime here is the best peice of advive I can give anyone:

                                                                                                                YOU WEBMASTERS: STOP ARMCHAIR LAWYERING THIS TO DEATH. GET A LAWYER, TALK TO HIM, AND SEE HOW THIS EFFECTS YOU BUSINESS MODEL. IT WILL KEEP YOU FROM GOING INSANE LOOKING AT GFY EVERY 2 MINUTES!
                                                                                                                http://donttellmehowtoruinmylife.com/ - http://www.jmdigitalmarketing.com/my...s-and-reviews/ - http://www.wouldyouhitit.org - http://shinyobjectreviews.com/

                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                  • NaughtyRob
                                                                                                                    Two fresh affiliate progs
                                                                                                                    • Nov 2004
                                                                                                                    • 29602
                                                                                                                    #179
                                                                                                                    Time for the shit to hit the fan.
                                                                                                                    [email protected]
                                                                                                                    Skype: 17026955414
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                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                      • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                        I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                        • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                        • 13449
                                                                                                                        #180
                                                                                                                        Originally posted by xxxjay
                                                                                                                        This one should, and deserves to beat that for a while. In the meantime here is the best peice of advive I can give anyone:

                                                                                                                        YOU WEBMASTERS: STOP ARMCHAIR LAWYERING THIS TO DEATH. GET A LAWYER, TALK TO HIM, AND SEE HOW THIS EFFECTS YOU BUSINESS MODEL. IT WILL KEEP YOU FROM GOING INSANE LOOKING AT GFY EVERY 2 MINUTES!
                                                                                                                        I agree with this 100% (except the armchair lawyering part....watching the confederacy of dunces ask questions like "are text tgp's ok?" is hilarious)

                                                                                                                        But definitely hire an industry attorney, have them look over your site(s) and advise you on the best course of action.
                                                                                                                        Nobody from GFY is going to come defend you at your trial.
                                                                                                                        sig too big

                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                          • Tipsy
                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                            • Jul 2001
                                                                                                                            • 6989
                                                                                                                            #181
                                                                                                                            Originally posted by xxxjay
                                                                                                                            IT WILL KEEP YOU FROM GOING INSANE LOOKING AT GFY EVERY 2 MINUTES!
                                                                                                                            For 90% of the board it's far too late and happened a long time before the current 2257 drama.
                                                                                                                            Ignorance is never bliss.

                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                              • MrChips
                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                • May 2005
                                                                                                                                • 1504
                                                                                                                                #182
                                                                                                                                Ok

                                                                                                                                Ok - if I put up a pic say last year, which I would now need the docs for - and I therefore now remove the pic cos there aint no way I can get hold of the docs - am I safe?

                                                                                                                                If so - I'll be taking some pics down im afraid - not many like some of you dudes may have to, but still theres some "cleaning up" I need to do.

                                                                                                                                If Im still not safe cos "I did it" then I may aswell leave them up no?

                                                                                                                                The net is going to be a much cleaner place - and thats what they wanted.

                                                                                                                                I hope those mainstream site designers are ready for us competing with them on the search engines

                                                                                                                                HO HO HO ;)

                                                                                                                                Poor bastards!!!!

                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                  • GatorB
                                                                                                                                    The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                    • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                    • 18208
                                                                                                                                    #183
                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by MrChips
                                                                                                                                    Ok - if I put up a pic say last year, which I would now need the docs for - and I therefore now remove the pic cos there aint no way I can get hold of the docs - am I safe?

                                                                                                                                    If so - I'll be taking some pics down im afraid - not many like some of you dudes may have to, but still theres some "cleaning up" I need to do.

                                                                                                                                    If Im still not safe cos "I did it" then I may aswell leave them up no?

                                                                                                                                    The net is going to be a much cleaner place - and thats what they wanted.

                                                                                                                                    I hope those mainstream site designers are ready for us competing with them on the search engines

                                                                                                                                    HO HO HO ;)

                                                                                                                                    Poor bastards!!!!
                                                                                                                                    Well if you don't have the doc then don't leave the pics up. Now these new rules don't take effect until June 23 so how can you be in violation NOW? You can't be busted for doing something that was legal at the time you were doing it.

                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                      • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                                        I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                                        • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                                        • 13449
                                                                                                                                        #184
                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by GatorB
                                                                                                                                        Well if you don't have the doc then don't leave the pics up. Now these new rules don't take effect until June 23 so how can you be in violation NOW? You can't be busted for doing something that was legal at the time you were doing it.
                                                                                                                                        WRONG.

                                                                                                                                        The law has been effective since 1995.

                                                                                                                                        The new stuff is just regulations specifying how the law will be enforced, the law itself hasn't changed.

                                                                                                                                        I bet you're hating that wayback machine now aren't ya?
                                                                                                                                        sig too big

                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                          • swedguy
                                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                            • Jan 2002
                                                                                                                                            • 7981
                                                                                                                                            #185
                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by xxxjay
                                                                                                                                            This one should, and deserves to beat that for a while. In the meantime here is the best peice of advive I can give anyone:

                                                                                                                                            YOU WEBMASTERS: STOP ARMCHAIR LAWYERING THIS TO DEATH. GET A LAWYER, TALK TO HIM, AND SEE HOW THIS EFFECTS YOU BUSINESS MODEL. IT WILL KEEP YOU FROM GOING INSANE LOOKING AT GFY EVERY 2 MINUTES!
                                                                                                                                            Hey it's fun armchair lawyering. Keeps your head in shape

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                                                                                                                                              • MrChips
                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                • May 2005
                                                                                                                                                • 1504
                                                                                                                                                #186
                                                                                                                                                Gator

                                                                                                                                                To be honest - I wouldnt know if I could be busted for doing something when it was legal when it comes to american law. There was talk of it being "retrospective".

                                                                                                                                                I suppose that means the 1995 bit - I see.

                                                                                                                                                Can I believe this -

                                                                                                                                                TEN FUCKING YEARS OF IMAGES WILL HAVE TO COME DOWN OFF THE NET

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                                                                                                                                                  • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                                                    I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                                                    • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                                                    • 13449
                                                                                                                                                    #187
                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by MrChips
                                                                                                                                                    To be honest - I wouldnt know if I could be busted for doing something when it was legal when it comes to american law. There was talk of it being "retrospective".

                                                                                                                                                    I suppose that means the 1995 bit - I see.

                                                                                                                                                    Can I believe this -

                                                                                                                                                    TEN FUCKING YEARS OF IMAGES WILL HAVE TO COME DOWN OFF THE NET
                                                                                                                                                    No, some of us have docs for every image we have on all of our sites, we won't have to take anything down.
                                                                                                                                                    sig too big

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                                                                                                                                                      • GatorB
                                                                                                                                                        The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                                        • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                        • 18208
                                                                                                                                                        #188
                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Lenny2
                                                                                                                                                        WRONG.

                                                                                                                                                        The law has been effective since 1995.

                                                                                                                                                        The new stuff is just regulations specifying how the law will be enforced, the law itself hasn't changed.

                                                                                                                                                        I bet you're hating that wayback machine now aren't ya?
                                                                                                                                                        So you are suggesting he leave the pics up?

                                                                                                                                                        I'm sure with all the CURRENT sites on the web they are going to go bother with some "way back" machine

                                                                                                                                                        Quit arguing with me for the sake of arguing. Until now he WAS NOT required to have the 2257 info ON HAND.

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                                                                                                                                                          • GatorB
                                                                                                                                                            The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                                            • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                            • 18208
                                                                                                                                                            #189
                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Lenny2
                                                                                                                                                            No, some of us have docs for every image we have on all of our sites, we won't have to take anything down.
                                                                                                                                                            So you have every thumb and pic cross reference dwith every url they are on WITH detailed descriptions of sexual actions appearing in said pics?

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                                                                                                                                                              • RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                                                • 9465
                                                                                                                                                                #190
                                                                                                                                                                lenny2: You might have paper for every image - but are you ready to go back an index EVERY page you have and cross reference each image to each document?

                                                                                                                                                                No matter who has what, very very few people are going to be totally compliant on this one.

                                                                                                                                                                Alex

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                                                                                                                                                                  • GatorB
                                                                                                                                                                    The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                                                    • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                                    • 18208
                                                                                                                                                                    #191
                                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by RawAlex
                                                                                                                                                                    lenny2: You might have paper for every image - but are you ready to go back an index EVERY page you have and cross reference each image to each document?

                                                                                                                                                                    No matter who has what, very very few people are going to be totally compliant on this one.

                                                                                                                                                                    Alex
                                                                                                                                                                    Exactly. You have to have very specific descriptions of each pic and listed every url which they may appear,

                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                      • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                                                                        I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                                                                        • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                                                                        • 13449
                                                                                                                                                                        #192
                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by GatorB
                                                                                                                                                                        So you are suggesting he leave the pics up?

                                                                                                                                                                        I'm sure with all the CURRENT sites on the web they are going to go bother with some "way back" machine

                                                                                                                                                                        Quit arguing with me for the sake of arguing. Until now he WAS NOT required to have the 2257 info ON HAND.
                                                                                                                                                                        Actually he was required to have the docs on hand according to the old regulations.
                                                                                                                                                                        Just because this law was never enforced doesn't mean it wasn't still the law.

                                                                                                                                                                        Now I happen to agree with the 10th circuit court who said that the secondary producer provisions in the regulations overreach the law, and in essence Justice is trying to rewrite the law the way they want it rather than enforcing the law that congress passed.

                                                                                                                                                                        After reading the comments today from the DOJ they seem to have a totally different point of view and unless you have the money to mount a legal challenge against the DOJ I would strongly suggest following the regs to the letter.
                                                                                                                                                                        sig too big

                                                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                                                          • MrChips
                                                                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                            • May 2005
                                                                                                                                                                            • 1504
                                                                                                                                                                            #193
                                                                                                                                                                            Ok

                                                                                                                                                                            That is correct - some of you will have all the docs - by definition producers must.

                                                                                                                                                                            For many though - the statement stands firm and true - ten years work down the pan.

                                                                                                                                                                            For instance - shouldnt producers holding documents now be issuing copies of these docs to ALL AFFILIATES who want them?

                                                                                                                                                                            That would be a good thing for affiliates, and a good thing for producers.

                                                                                                                                                                            Have any affiliates for example posted their requests off yet?

                                                                                                                                                                            How about this - if the changes stand firm in the regs, then if you like - and it may be a good idea - I can write an online document distribution system.

                                                                                                                                                                            Thats all we need - so that secondaries can reproduce hard copies at their own offices.

                                                                                                                                                                            No big deal - it would take me about 6 days to code and would sort 99% of this mess out.

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                                                                                                                                                                              • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                                                                                I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                                                                                • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                • 13449
                                                                                                                                                                                #194
                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by GatorB
                                                                                                                                                                                So you have every thumb and pic cross reference dwith every url they are on WITH detailed descriptions of sexual actions appearing in said pics?
                                                                                                                                                                                There is nothing in the law or the regs that requires a description of the sexual actions in the pictures.

                                                                                                                                                                                As for having the docs indexed and whatnot, we have our shit together. We've been preparing for this for 11 months.
                                                                                                                                                                                sig too big

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                                                                                                                                                                                  • Nate-MM2
                                                                                                                                                                                    So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                    • Sep 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                    • 263
                                                                                                                                                                                    #195
                                                                                                                                                                                    Even if the injunction falls flat, webmasters WILL have other options.

                                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                      • GatorB
                                                                                                                                                                                        The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                                                                        • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                        • 18208
                                                                                                                                                                                        #196
                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Lenny2
                                                                                                                                                                                        Actually he was required to have the docs on hand according to the old regulations.
                                                                                                                                                                                        Just because this law was never enforced doesn't mean it wasn't still the law.

                                                                                                                                                                                        Now I happen to agree with the 10th circuit court who said that the secondary producer provisions in the regulations overreach the law, and in essence Justice is trying to rewrite the law the way they want it rather than enforcing the law that congress passed.

                                                                                                                                                                                        After reading the comments today from the DOJ they seem to have a totally different point of view and unless you have the money to mount a legal challenge against the DOJ I would strongly suggest following the regs to the letter.

                                                                                                                                                                                        Any pages that have to be 2257 compliant will be taken down. I'm 100% positive that the government IF they go afer anyone at all( they have yet to go after ANYONE under the old regs in over a dozen years ) they will be going after WORKING WEBSITES not some webpage cached back in the nether regions of google.

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                                                                                                                                                                                          • galleryseek
                                                                                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                            • Mar 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                            • 8234
                                                                                                                                                                                            #197
                                                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Nate-MM2
                                                                                                                                                                                            Even if the injunction falls flat, webmasters WILL have other options.
                                                                                                                                                                                            Thanks for telling us what those other options are!

                                                                                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                              • Matt_WildCash
                                                                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                                • Jan 2003
                                                                                                                                                                                                • 1699
                                                                                                                                                                                                #198
                                                                                                                                                                                                Where does it say you have to have cross referanced every image and video with every URL?

                                                                                                                                                                                                Try the New XMovies.com and make more $$$ with your Traffic

                                                                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                  • Snake Doctor
                                                                                                                                                                                                    I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • Mar 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • 13449
                                                                                                                                                                                                    #199
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Nate-MM2
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Even if the injunction falls flat, webmasters WILL have other options.
                                                                                                                                                                                                    I'm 99% sure that the FSC will get an injunction.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    The fact that the DOJ insisted on leaving in the secondary producer provision almost guarantees that IMHO.
                                                                                                                                                                                                    All they have to do is walk into court and cite as precedent Reno V. Sundance where the 10th circuit said the Justice Dept was overreaching the law by trying to "create" two kinds of producers, when the law itself says there's only one.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    To get an injunction you have to prove to the judge that you're likely to win the case......If I were a betting man I'd bet that's all the proof they'll need.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    After the injunction is issued, it will be tied up in court for years regardless of who wins, because the other side will appeal.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    That's my
                                                                                                                                                                                                    sig too big

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                      • GatorB
                                                                                                                                                                                                        The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • 18208
                                                                                                                                                                                                        #200
                                                                                                                                                                                                        I will hazzard a guess that this will mean that sponsors( at least US sponsors ) will stop handing out free content( at least to US webmasters ).

                                                                                                                                                                                                          Comment

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