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Relish XXX

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#1

DDOS attacks - How do you prevent them from happening?

04-21-2005, 01:14 AM

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/...d800fa55e.html

Do you need one of these set up by your servers? Is it up to you to pay for this or should your hosting company have one to look out over all the servers that they are running?
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stev0

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#2

04-21-2005, 02:22 AM

I wonder how much one of those babys goes for
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#3

04-21-2005, 02:25 AM

Originally posted by stev0

I wonder how much one of those babys goes for

about $72k

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#4

04-21-2005, 02:26 AM

Well id hope any place i hosted with had the smarts to have a good ddos protection guard on their networks if they didnt they would just be setting the networks up for alot of downtime and loss money.
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Relish XXX

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#5

04-21-2005, 02:26 AM

Originally posted by stev0

I wonder how much one of those babys goes for

$66k

I think all hosting companies should have one in the co-location facility looking after their clients.
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#6

04-21-2005, 02:28 AM

Originally posted by Relish XXX

DDOS attacks - How do you prevent them from happening?

You don't piss important people off.
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fris

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#7

04-21-2005, 03:20 AM

usally the hosting company will null route your ip until the attack stops

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Relish XXX

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#8

04-21-2005, 04:21 AM

Should all hosting companies have adequate hardware to prevent this?
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#9

04-21-2005, 04:33 AM

Originally posted by stev0

I wonder how much one of those babys goes for

just found this http://reviews.cnet.com/Cisco_Guard_...-31208569.html
so 72K is about right...

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#10

04-21-2005, 04:45 AM

Originally posted by Relish XXX

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/...d800fa55e.html

Do you need one of these set up by your servers? Is it up to you to pay for this or should your hosting company have one to look out over all the servers that they are running?

Wow, thats one elite piece of hardware. I wonder which, if any of the major webhosts use them.

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#11

04-21-2005, 04:53 AM

Originally posted by SomeCreep

Wow, thats one elite piece of hardware. I wonder which, if any of the major webhosts use them.

the ones that do don't post at GFY ;)
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#12

04-21-2005, 04:53 AM

Originally posted by SomeCreep

Wow, thats one elite piece of hardware. I wonder which, if any of the major webhosts use them.

theplanet, rackspace and i think EV1 might have it
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#13

04-21-2005, 04:54 AM

Originally posted by Rui

the ones that do don't post at GFY ;)

Dont you think Web Air, Jupiter, Mojo. ISPrime etc should have hardware like that?
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#14

04-21-2005, 04:54 AM

nulllroute IP being attacked

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Relish XXX

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#15

04-21-2005, 04:54 AM

Originally posted by sickbeatz

nulllroute IP being attacked

If you null route that would mean your site goes down right?
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#16

04-21-2005, 04:55 AM

Get a host(s) with big enough pipes they can't get flooded and then make sure they're nice enough to be able to throttle down upstream requests if necessary.

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Relish XXX

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#17

04-21-2005, 04:58 AM

Originally posted by psili

Get a host(s) with big enough pipes they can't get flooded and then make sure they're nice enough to be able to throttle down upstream requests if necessary.

Mensniche who have been fucked for nearly 2 days now and totally down host with Cave Creek.

Originally posted by Cavecreek.com

Cavecreek has grown to become one of the largest bandwidth providers in the world, allocating major resources to guarantee that they maintain their leadership in service, support and security.
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#18

04-21-2005, 04:59 AM

Originally posted by Relish XXX

Dont you think Web Air, Jupiter, Mojo. ISPrime etc should have hardware like that?

I was wondering about Isprime also. They host some of the biggest porn sites online, so I imagine they do have some kind of effective protection that guards against DDOS attacks, whether it be hardware or software.

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#19

04-21-2005, 05:00 AM

Originally posted by Relish XXX

If you null route that would mean your site goes down right?

The IP that's being attacked

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Relish XXX

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#20

04-21-2005, 05:01 AM

Originally posted by sickbeatz

The IP that's being attacked

So you could just get a new IP really quickly?
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Relish XXX

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#21

04-21-2005, 05:04 AM

Originally posted by SomeCreep

I was wondering about Isprime also. They host some of the biggest porn sites online, so I imagine they do have some kind of effective protection that guards against DDOS attacks, whether it be hardware or software.

In my opinion all of them should have something like that period.
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#22

04-21-2005, 06:27 AM

Originally posted by pstation

theplanet, rackspace and i think EV1 might have it

I DO know that EV1 has them in place.

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#23

04-21-2005, 06:31 AM

Go with rackspace if uptime is important, words can't describe how great they are
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#24

04-21-2005, 06:36 AM

Now from a technical point of view.

Those hardware pieces are great for minor attacks. They do not stop large attacks.

Just like your anti virus software always needs updates because the virus makers keep getting smarter. The same analogy applies. Most hosting companies have hardware in place. However when an attack happens it doesn't mean there is 100% percent protection.

What is being suggexted in this thread is that hosting companies should buy the newest and latest equipment everytime it comes out to protect 100% against attacks. If hosting companies did that simple virtual accounts would cost $100's of dollars a month to keep up with the updates.

Now saying that most big routers that your hosting companies use does prevent most attacks. The mensniche attack is a new attack that can be studied later and prevented against.

I know for a fact Cave Creek has good equipment and they are doing everything within thier power to stop the attacks.

These types of attacks can happen to anybody at any time this is one thing I always warn against when hosts say they guarantee 100% uptime.

<time for hosts to flame me now>
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#25

04-21-2005, 06:39 AM

Originally posted by JFPdude

Now from a technical point of view.

Those hardware pieces are great for minor attacks. They do not stop large attacks.

Just like your anti virus software always needs updates because the virus makers keep getting smarter. The same analogy applies. Most hosting companies have hardware in place. However when an attack happens it doesn't mean there is 100% percent protection.

The hardware works great for "large attacks", depending on what your definition of it is. I had a 700mbit syn flood attack at theplanet a while back and the attack was blocked and filtered within 15 minutes
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#26

04-21-2005, 06:41 AM

Originally posted by pstation

The hardware works great for "large attacks", depending on what your definition of it is. I had a 700mbit syn flood attack at theplanet a while back and the attack was blocked and filtered within 15 minutes

DEPENDING on the type of attack.

Theplanet was also attacked not long ago and it wasn't stopped.
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#27

04-21-2005, 07:47 AM

Originally posted by Relish XXX

Dont you think Web Air, Jupiter, Mojo. ISPrime etc should have hardware like that?

I would bet most don't, anyway this sort of protection comes at an (justified) additonal costs most people in here don't even think about beeing possible to pay in hosting
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#28

04-21-2005, 08:46 AM

Originally posted by DarkJedi

You don't piss important people off.

................

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#29

04-21-2005, 09:04 AM

Originally posted by DarkJedi

You don't piss important people off.

Script kiddiots/mailers are important people?
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#30

04-21-2005, 09:05 AM

Originally posted by sickbeatz

nulllroute IP being attacked

Oh look the kiddiots give us CCIE advice...
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#31

04-21-2005, 09:07 AM

I don't know what the fucking planet you are on, but $100k+ of Cisco/Juniper equipment is not gonna stop a 15Gbit/sec DDoS on your dialup modem....
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#32

04-21-2005, 09:17 AM

Originally posted by Relish XXX

In my opinion all of them should have something like that period.

The problem with something like that is it is very expensive and most customers in adult dont want to pay the added expense for equiptment like this. Everyone in this business wants their hosting for little or nothing and it doesnt give the hosts a choice to buy equiptment like this when they are making small margins to begin with. If you were willing to pay the added expense for this type of equiptment thats a different story, but most are not willing to foot the extra bill. Just my

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#33

04-21-2005, 09:17 AM

Originally posted by nmcog

Script kiddiots/mailers are important people?

lol, damn Jedi is stupid

i luv mainstream
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#34

04-21-2005, 09:21 AM

Originally posted by bringer

about $72k

pretty good investment if you want to keep your hosting company around for a while
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#35

04-21-2005, 09:32 AM

Originally posted by Relish XXX

Mensniche who have been fucked for nearly 2 days now and totally down host with Cave Creek.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavecreek.com
Cavecreek has grown to become one of the largest bandwidth providers in the world.

I don't know about this.

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#36

04-21-2005, 09:38 AM

There are a lot of really good points in this thread.

I think this one is one of the best:

The problem with something like that is it is very expensive and most customers in adult don?t want to pay the added expense for equipment like this.

A lot of hosts have the capital and even the in-house expertise to setup and maintain a piece of hardware capable of preventing (almost all) DDoS attacks. However, all the time and cost put into implementing something like this translates into the need for more revenue.

It's no different then buying really high quality movies for your site. If you buy well shot, attractive model movies, you expect to pay more and in turn, charge your customers more.

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#37

04-21-2005, 09:41 AM

RIP
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Sorry flash back from my CCNA class
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pstation

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#38

04-21-2005, 09:49 AM

Originally posted by loverboy

pretty good investment if you want to keep your hosting company around for a while

not exactly, it doesn't make sense for most companies to spend >$200,000 to protect only a handful of customers

also, don't forget that you typically need this as well, which costs another $37k, and then staff is needed to maintain and monitor it as well

if you happen to attract attacks, then you should pay the premium for a company liek rackspace to handle your servers

Last edited by pstation; 04-21-2005, 09:50 AM.
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#39

04-21-2005, 10:10 AM

It all comes down to $$$$, if there are customers willing to pay for it hosts will install it. But i do not think maybe pure adult hosts will be running out to install this since most adult guys want everything for nothing and are not willing to pay for it but want it included for free. Tell me would an adult guys like to pay an addtional $1500-$2000 a month for this protection? Im sure not too many would be.

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#40

04-21-2005, 10:13 AM

Originally posted by SinisterStudios

The problem with something like that is it is very expensive and most customers in adult dont want to pay the added expense for equiptment like this. Everyone in this business wants their hosting for little or nothing and it doesnt give the hosts a choice to buy equiptment like this when they are making small margins to begin with. If you were willing to pay the added expense for this type of equiptment thats a different story, but most are not willing to foot the extra bill. Just my

I was called an Idiot for replying similar to this in another thread. But I agree 100%

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#41

04-21-2005, 10:14 AM

I have one of those in my bathroom
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