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GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum (https://gfy.com/index.php)
-   Fucking Around & Business Discussion (https://gfy.com/forumdisplay.php?f=26)
-   -   Our Position Regarding RedTube and Tube Sites (https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=807515)

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 07:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shap (Post 13785785)
You have me on icq. I'm in. :thumbsup
I hope it all works out. I know I would personally love to say let's do it, I hope it makes a difference. I know that there are a few companies who could do it, but the majority won't be able to sustain something that potentially huge that could carry on for years and years.

DaddyHalbucks 02-15-2008 07:57 AM
It seems to me you are saying it is OK to advertise on a pirate site simply because your ads only appear on pages with your content. Is that right?

If so, you are still supporting a pirate site. How about all the other alleged stolen content from your GFY colleagues? You are profiting off stolen content because that stolen content is attracting viewers to the tube site. That is why viewers go there.

Please correct me if I have this wrong.

testpie 02-15-2008 08:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13785446)
Here's an idea. You change the way surfers use the internet, you stop everyone from sharing content, you stop tube sites from appearing, magically, and they won't be a problem anymore.
I sincerely hope that was sarcasm and not an example of you being a utopian liberal yoghurt-eating fruitcake who swans around their home in sandals made of organic hemp and a 100% recycled organic tunic.

Bassmaster 02-15-2008 08:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makaveli (Post 13780223)
I don't understand whats so hard about protecting your content? Why not use DRM? Wouldn't that solve all this bullshit?? I hear stuff like oh the surfers hates it, they leave if they can't download the videos. You know what I say? FUCK the Surfer. If you have high quality exclusive content then will he really leave if he's a fan of your stuff? No he'll stay a member as long as he was going too anyway, then once he cancels his membership he gets no more access to your content. Cya wanker, want access again? Pay me. You spend millions on content and just leave it out in the open for anybody to come in and take it?? Doesn't make sense to me.:2 cents:
Great response!!! If more people in our industry start thinking like this, it can help solve the problem. We are all in this business to make a living! Even though we might have competitive programs, it is US against the Criminals!!! Power in numbers!!!

Shap 02-15-2008 08:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassmaster (Post 13785984)
Great response!!! If more people in our industry start thinking like this, it can help solve the problem. We are all in this business to make a living! Even though we might have competitive programs, it is US against the Criminals!!! Power in numbers!!!
That was one of the dumbest posts in the entire thread. It's too bad you chose that one to agree with.

Btw just so I'm clear you agree with the attitude "Fuck The Surfer"?

Jet - BANNED FOR LIFE 02-15-2008 08:34 AM
Shap is an asshole who supports thieves.

cherrylula 02-15-2008 08:39 AM
OMG there is stolen content on the internets...if you browse the internet you must support stealing!!

boycott the internet and help stop pirates!

OldSchoolJim 02-15-2008 08:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jet (Post 13786021)
Shap is an asshole who supports thieves.

says the guy with the brazzers sig....to fuckin funny


Also...Shap...i dont have your icq #...could you hit me up for a biz discussion?

halfpint 02-15-2008 08:44 AM
Shap when you have some free time could you contact me via ICQ please

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 08:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassmaster (Post 13785984)
Great response!!! If more people in our industry start thinking like this, it can help solve the problem. We are all in this business to make a living! Even though we might have competitive programs, it is US against the Criminals!!! Power in numbers!!!

Unfortunately DRM is not foolproof, it gets cracked and it's not a real solution, it's more of a bandaid. People say "fuck the surfer" but in the end, who is it that buys memberships to the sites? It's the same surfer we say "fuck you" to. There is ALWAYS a happy medium for those willing to find it, and in doing so, you often send the "fuck you" to the thieves you thwart by going around them ;)

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 08:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shap (Post 13785994)
That was one of the dumbest posts in the entire thread. It's too bad you chose that one to agree with.

Btw just so I'm clear you agree with the attitude "Fuck The Surfer"?
I know, shocking.

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 09:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by testpie (Post 13785978)
I sincerely hope that was sarcasm and not an example of you being a utopian liberal yoghurt-eating fruitcake who swans around their home in sandals made of organic hemp and a 100% recycled organic tunic.
Bingo :P

BVF 02-15-2008 09:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786087)
I know, shocking.
Ok LadyMischief...You're cool peoples and all but Gotdamn, haven't you had your fill of Shap's Ass Poo for awhile?

Kevin Marx 02-15-2008 09:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shap (Post 13785785)
You have me on icq. I'm in. :thumbsup
Shap, kudos to you for finally the right comment at the right time.

I don't agree with your decisions regarding RedTube, but as has been pointed out here, it's your business. At least it's a step away from content theft, even if it's only your content on RedTube (it's unfortunate you can't/won't negotiate them away from all illcit content).

If I had the funds, I would be right there as well. I'm not so sure anyone but the big sites can afford it and it's unsettling to see so few stepping up to the bar.

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 09:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin-SFBucks (Post 13786100)
Shap, kudos to you for finally the right comment at the right time.

I don't agree with your decisions regarding RedTube, but as has been pointed out here, it's your business. At least it's a step away from content theft, even if it's only your content on RedTube (it's unfortunate you can't/won't negotiate them away from all illcit content).

If I had the funds, I would be right there as well. I'm not so sure anyone but the big sites can afford it and it's unsettling to see so few stepping up to the bar.
Many have many times in the past, and end up holding the bag for everyone. How does that help anyone? A few big companies spend their time, money, and resources fighting for the rest of the industry to make money? Sounds like utopia, the reality is far different. Do you think that all the big movie studios should foot the bill for the copyright fight for every small little b movie producer and the rest of the industry..... for what? Postarity? Because it's a nice thing to do? Let's be real, we would ALL love to jump on that bandwagon, I bet every single person in this thread would if they could. Wishes are like fishes and the sea is full of them... we all wish we could, the reality is, we all have to do the best we can to figure out what works for us, no?

Bassmaster 02-15-2008 09:09 AM
:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 09:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BVF (Post 13786097)
Ok LadyMischief...You're cool peoples and all but Gotdamn, haven't you had your fill of Shap's Ass Poo for awhile?
It's not about Shap.. it's about making people realize there is a wish, and there is a reality. People always soldier for this cause or the other, but often the ones who talk the loudest are the ones who slink away when it comes to putting dollars on the table, or getting the gumption to follow things through. We all wish this crap would just dry up and go away. We wish there was a blanket solution to this problem. There isn't. What do most businesses do when they have a problem that they have tried to solve one way, again and again, and it just doesn't work? Einstein defined insanity as doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Why is it that instead of finding solutions that the ENTIRE industry can action, people are continuing in insanity? I'm not saying protecting your rights to your own content is insane, but when we've done this dance for the 50th time and nothing is different, you think we'd ask to change the tune?

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 09:16 AM
Here's a question. How many people here have had their own site members report content being used illegally on another site to the site it was stolen from?

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 09:23 AM
What would happen if everyone put a little message in their member's area, "Hey, if you see our content elsewhere, report it to us and get a free DHD, or a free month membership"

testpie 02-15-2008 09:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786170)
What would happen if everyone put a little message in their member's area, "Hey, if you see our content elsewhere, report it to us and get a free DHD, or a free month membership"
Much as I idealise your optimism, I willing to bet the answer to that is they cancel their membership with you after they, at your command, go out and find a place which is offering your member's area for free.

ultimatebbwdotcom 02-15-2008 10:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786170)
What would happen if everyone put a little message in their member's area, "Hey, if you see our content elsewhere, report it to us and get a free DHD, or a free month membership"
Would be a great idea if i didnt think the same member who reported it wasn't the one to put it there to get his free month.

LiveDose 02-15-2008 10:52 AM
A long read but a good read, Shap.

tony286 02-15-2008 10:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786148)
Here's a question. How many people here have had their own site members report content being used illegally on another site to the site it was stolen from?
Sometimes they do my wife has a loyal bunch also ultimatebbwcom really has had my back out there and im grateful if ever he needs something I will be there for him. Ive also have told others if all of us did that and not just worried about just our own.They would be in a snowstorm of dcma's.

xxxice 02-15-2008 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13785509)
Well see here is the root of the problem! Finally you get it.. Tube sites are a MEDIA that surfers have embraced as a media delivery method, AND a way to share community. It's the content THEFT that is the issue. Now, since you are actually thinking about this, let's think LOGICALLY. How many content producers can/will/are able to pursue legal action against every single site that is illegally distributing their content. Now, take those same content producers who sit and watch their content being stolen and distributed, and give them the option, say "Hey. Ok, so I can't stop these assholes from stealing my stuff. Maybe it would be in my best interest to TALK to them, figure out a way I can give them something they want, I can get traffic out of the deal, and then they aren't going to STEAL my content anymore, suddenly I can control my content, provide them with what *I* want them to have, and build accountability where there wasn't some before". Sure, Redtube may not be "100% legit" , but, don't you think if enough producers put the pressure on and put them in a box, it wouldn't force the issue? I'm trying to provide alternatives here that people can actually action, not the righteous battle that will end in martyrdom and no results for the vast majority of people who are affected the most. Do you get me NOW? :)
You have your own spin and sounds like giving into to thieves to me. You even admit that it is not 100% legit. If we make them play by the rules for us it is ok. LOL seems to have gone real well https://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-business-discussion/807661-shap-answer-please-redtube-following-rules-2.html. Oh they don't have the backend right now to account for this. Talk about a dream world lol what you are asking for is the most far-fetched thing I have ever heard. Your alternative is nothing more than giving up and embracing theft enjoy.

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 11:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by testpie (Post 13786193)
Much as I idealise your optimism, I willing to bet the answer to that is they cancel their membership with you after they, at your command, go out and find a place which is offering your member's area for free.
I tend to disagree, and that hasn't been the case with a lot of people who's given us this kind of information. Again, it's about providing more of an experience than just providing content, it requires building a relationship with your consumer base, even from a corporate level. When someone feels personally involved or responsible for a product on any level, it's something they do from a personal sense of obligation. Consumers are not entirely as stupid as most people assume them to be.

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 11:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13786498)
Sometimes they do my wife has a loyal bunch also ultimatebbwcom really has had my back out there and im grateful if ever he needs something I will be there for him. Ive also have told others if all of us did that and not just worried about just our own.They would be in a snowstorm of dcma's.
Well think here, a lot of people are not using a very good resource that's already there, and it's just those kinds of things that can make a difference. We can't depend on our "competitors" to watch our backs, but the people who are really fans, the ones willing to spend money on a product, are the ones who are willing to pay for what they really want, and it's in their interests to preserve it. This is the reason the record industry still makes money off CD sales even though you can get any song in the universe for free on the internet. There is ALWAYS going to be a good core group of people who believe in supporting a product, supporting the providers of a product, or feel strongly about things. Those people will always keep us going, and with the right kind of encouragement, they forge the way for the next generation of "surfers" or "consumers" to do things the right way. Educating consumers about the benifits of buying as opposed to stealing can be as effective as 100 lawsuits.

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 11:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanderweb (Post 13786537)
You have your own spin and sounds like giving into to thieves to me. You even admit that it is not 100&#37; legit. If we make them play by the rules for us it is ok. LOL seems to have gone real well https://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-business-discussion/807661-shap-answer-please-redtube-following-rules-2.html. Oh they don't have the backend right now to account for this. Talk about a dream world lol what you are asking for is the most far-fetched thing I have ever heard. Your alternative is nothing more than giving up and embracing theft enjoy.
Well if you choose to see it that way, go ahead. I'm glad he put them in a position where he can screw his thumb into them, they are accountable to him and he can be more in control with the way he's done things, isn't that better than not having any way of holding them accountable for mishandling things? I hope they fix things the way Shap asks them, and if they don't, I hope he nails them. That's the whole point, making them accountable in the way he did put HIM in control of the situation again.

Wiseman 02-15-2008 11:23 AM
God I love reading this Thread.

tony286 02-15-2008 11:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786574)
Well think here, a lot of people are not using a very good resource that's already there, and it's just those kinds of things that can make a difference. We can't depend on our "competitors" to watch our backs, but the people who are really fans, the ones willing to spend money on a product, are the ones who are willing to pay for what they really want, and it's in their interests to preserve it. This is the reason the record industry still makes money off CD sales even though you can get any song in the universe for free on the internet. There is ALWAYS going to be a good core group of people who believe in supporting a product, supporting the providers of a product, or feel strongly about things. Those people will always keep us going, and with the right kind of encouragement, they forge the way for the next generation of "surfers" or "consumers" to do things the right way. Educating consumers about the benifits of buying as opposed to stealing can be as effective as 100 lawsuits.
Actually ultimate bbw is probably one of my biggest competitors. lol To say I cant give a another site a heads up because they are my competition is stupid. They may be competition but we are all getting fucked together. In bbw I have found people always let others know if we see something that could be a problem for someone. Ive given heads up to all types of sites big and small, all I expect is a thank you.No thank you I turn a blind eye if I come across their stuff.

Shap 02-15-2008 11:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiseman (Post 13786651)
God I love reading this Thread.
I thought you might :winkwink:

LadyMischief 02-15-2008 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13786653)
Actually ultimate bbw is probably one of my biggest competitors. lol To say I cant give a another site a heads up because they are my competition is stupid. They may be competition but we are all getting fucked together. In bbw I have found people always let others know if we see something that could be a problem for someone. Ive given heads up to all types of sites big and small, all I expect is a thank you.No thank you I turn a blind eye if I come across their stuff.
You would do that, but you can't really EXPECT others to do it in return, because we both know most of them won't do that. Smaller niches are lucky that way they get more from co-operating, but honestly there's so many people who wouldn't, especially as the companies/competition get bigger. We like to hope that people in the biz will help each other out, but we're naive if we expect it.

tony286 02-15-2008 11:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786661)
You would do that, but you can't really EXPECT others to do it in return, because we both know most of them won't do that. Smaller niches are lucky that way they get more from co-operating, but honestly there's so many people who wouldn't, especially as the companies/competition get bigger. We like to hope that people in the biz will help each other out, but we're naive if we expect it.
Well if we dont do it first, how can we expect it to happen? It takes so little effort. It sounds to me your path has been decided, I wish you the best.

lbc213 02-15-2008 12:02 PM
wow that was a long read. I hope seriously damaging you rep is worth it shap.

My 2cents

ThumbLord 02-15-2008 12:15 PM
nice reading this is, made my day, thanks

TheSenator 02-15-2008 12:22 PM
Mo Money Mo Problems = Shap

I don't think it was wise to make a deal with the devil but ultimately you have to sleep with it.

V_RocKs 02-15-2008 03:06 PM
You know what Shap. I shouldn't have been so vulgar. It really wasn't your fault any more than it is anyone elses fault when they get conned. These illegal tube guys are scammers and I can only imagine how they spun it for you.

I am sorry for my comments and how they made you look.

Wiseman 02-15-2008 05:18 PM
bump for good times. lol

will76 02-15-2008 06:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shap (Post 13785994)
That was one of the dumbest posts in the entire thread. It's too bad you chose that one to agree with.

Btw just so I'm clear you agree with the attitude "Fuck The Surfer"?
don't you have a PRE checked box for a cross sale with Brazzers ? (answer is yes) I know you guys are very pro surfer which is fine with me i could care less but doesn't having a prechecked cross sale a no no for people who want to be surfer friendly???

I don't see how you can come across as someone who cares so much about surfers then hit them with a prechecked cross sale. Personally I dont have a problem with a prechecked cross sale, just saying, you are either one way or the other.

will76 02-15-2008 06:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786170)
What would happen if everyone put a little message in their member's area, "Hey, if you see our content elsewhere, report it to us and get a free DHD, or a free month membership"
LOL then content being posted on tube sites would go through the roof and your real paying customers would never pay for their membership fees..... great idea. :helpme

will76 02-15-2008 06:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by V_RocKs (Post 13787915)
You know what Shap. I shouldn't have been so vulgar. It really wasn't your fault any more than it is anyone elses fault when they get conned. These illegal tube guys are scammers and I can only imagine how they spun it for you.

I am sorry for my comments and how they made you look.
how they spun it... :1orglaugh

I can hear it now:

Listen hear Shap, don't believe what those idiots on GFY say about us. Redtube has NO stolen content on our site. Well we do have a little but we working on it bro, we want to be 100&#37; legit! We want to work together with you, what do you say come on give us a try bro. Come on what you think, did i mention we are a top 100 alexa ranking site and we have more traffic than god ? Come on Shap you know you want a little piece of our traffic, i promiss we do nothing shady on our site... what you have requirements... oh sure man we will do whatever you say, just give us your requirements :helpme


and the fact that they were known theives, what in the hell did anyone expect them to be honest. How do they " spun it" so they make themselves not look like theives...

anyway. whatever. who cares. apparently most people dont.

Theo 02-15-2008 06:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786574)
There is ALWAYS going to be a good core group of people who believe in supporting a product, supporting the providers of a product, or feel strongly about things. Those people will always keep us going, and with the right kind of encouragement, they forge the way for the next generation of "surfers" or "consumers" to do things the right way. Educating consumers about the benifits of buying as opposed to stealing can be as effective as 100 lawsuits.
Trust me you don't want to see this day coming where we'll depend on the good faith of few to sustain a level of sales.

Wolfy 02-15-2008 08:37 PM
I remember the days when I used to actually read this bullshit.




:1orglaugh

Kevsh 02-15-2008 10:20 PM
Hmm, well I don't own content so really I'm not in a situation to speak from experience but ethically ....

While I certainly sympathize with the frustration of having content stolen and being able to do little about it, in the end if you are working with RedTube and others then you are leveraging their traffic for your own gain - traffic that is there to get stolen porn.

As well, you are helping keep these sites in business by providing your content (likely more retention for them), at the expense of further exposing your competitors stolen content (as well as friends and colleagues).

Sorry, there has to be a better way than sleeping with the devil.
:2cents

will76 02-15-2008 10:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13785509)
Well see here is the root of the problem! Finally you get it.. Tube sites are a MEDIA that surfers have embraced as a media delivery method, AND a way to share community. It's the content THEFT that is the issue. Now, since you are actually thinking about this, let's think LOGICALLY. How many content producers can/will/are able to pursue legal action against every single site that is illegally distributing their content. Now, take those same content producers who sit and watch their content being stolen and distributed, and give them the option, say "Hey. Ok, so I can't stop these assholes from stealing my stuff. Maybe it would be in my best interest to TALK to them, figure out a way I can give them something they want, I can get traffic out of the deal, and then they aren't going to STEAL my content anymore, suddenly I can control my content, provide them with what *I* want them to have, and build accountability where there wasn't some before". Sure, Redtube may not be "100% legit" , but, don't you think if enough producers put the pressure on and put them in a box, it wouldn't force the issue? I'm trying to provide alternatives here that people can actually action, not the righteous battle that will end in martyrdom and no results for the vast majority of people who are affected the most. Do you get me NOW? :)
LOL " i got it " about 6 months ago about tube sites and I have been posting the same stuff about it since then, but thanks for your approval that I finally got it.

BTW, working with these people is not the solution. Shap's case is a perfect example. When you manage to convert theives into honest business people then let me know what body of water you walking on.....

they want your full length videos, do you get it? because if redtube has all 2 mins videos then all of their surfers will go to megarotic, or youporn. Getting 1 of these sites to go legit would take an act of god, getting all of them to go legit is impossible. So you will have the sex search / AFF scenerio, why is one going to make changes to make you happy and then lose traffic to their competitors???? its not going to happen. They will tell you to fuck off and keep allowing your full length content to be posted on their site. DO YOU GET IT ????

just like your idea to give members of your site a free month to point our your content when they find it on tube sites... bad idea, aint going to happen, sorry.

venus 02-15-2008 11:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shap (Post 13780446)
I treat my clients better than anyone else in this industry. ?
Wow... this is a big ass industry. was not aware you knew how every website owner treated its customers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shap (Post 13780446)
My top priority is treating every single client of mine like gold. How many other people in this industry can you say that about?
I guess according to you no one.

will76 02-15-2008 11:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by venus (Post 13789848)
Wow... this is a big ass industry. was not aware you knew how every website owner treated its customers.



I guess according to you no one.
strange thing for him to say and then to do something like this on his join pages:

http://www.teamclickcash.com/funny/twistys.jpg

prechecked cross sales = " I treat my clients better than anyone else in this industry. ? My top priority is treating every single client of mine like gold. How many other people in this industry can you say that about? "

Iron Fist 02-15-2008 11:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyMischief (Post 13786115)
Many have many times in the past, and end up holding the bag for everyone. How does that help anyone? A few big companies spend their time, money, and resources fighting for the rest of the industry to make money? Sounds like utopia, the reality is far different. Do you think that all the big movie studios should foot the bill for the copyright fight for every small little b movie producer and the rest of the industry..... for what? Postarity? Because it's a nice thing to do? Let's be real, we would ALL love to jump on that bandwagon, I bet every single person in this thread would if they could. Wishes are like fishes and the sea is full of them... we all wish we could, the reality is, we all have to do the best we can to figure out what works for us, no?
More elaborate but exactly what I said earlier.... nice to see someone with a dose of reality in here.

http://www.nnteenmodels.net/gfy/clapping.gif

PenisFace 02-16-2008 12:33 AM
There's only one solution to tube sites: Everyone who has a decent sized network of sites - GOOGLE BOMB! I've already got several sites that are listed in good spots on Google with "tube" somewhere in the keyword/phrase. Maybe if everyone started doing that, coupled with massive trojan installs on surfers machines, they'd be less likely to be a bunch of freeloaders :2 cents:

Or maybe I'm retarded.

pocketkangaroo 02-16-2008 12:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenisFace (Post 13790115)
There's only one solution to tube sites: Everyone who has a decent sized network of sites - GOOGLE BOMB! I've already got several sites that are listed in good spots on Google with "tube" somewhere in the keyword/phrase. Maybe if everyone started doing that, coupled with massive trojan installs on surfers machines, they'd be less likely to be a bunch of freeloaders :2 cents:

Or maybe I'm retarded.
I don't see how building their link popularity is going to hurt their sites.

If you want to do something easy, redirect your Chinese traffic to their longer videos.

Brujah 02-16-2008 12:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfy (Post 13789452)
I remember the days when I used to actually read this bullshit.

:1orglaugh
It's ok to read it. Worry about it when you start actually believing it.


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