Okies... if you say so

I normally stay away from trolling threads so I am not sure why I am so involved with this but so it is. Let me first untwist my words that you did such a good job of knotting up.

1. I never said to put anyone down like a dog. There is a huge diffrence between natrual selection and letting nature run its corse then killing people. Im tlaking darwin here not hitler.

ie. The original question was not about old people or kids it was some woman who had no job and spit out kids. Simle answer give the kids to a family that cant have any leave the mother in the cold and eventually she will work or starve problem solved.


2. Old people, children, and disabled people deserve some level of help. Especially veterans who fought to keep us safe. I am not supporting Ron Paul here.

I simply believe most people can climb out if they are motivated but the current system leaves no reason to be motivated as though it may suck to be on social assistance you can survive. Some even like it. I knew many people that used and abused the system and had no problem living like shit. I feel if they were forced to choose between starve or work they would work but to choose between mcdonalds and govt cheese they took the cheese.

As for luck that is BS. I was taught while training to be a stock broker that luck is when preperation meets opportunity. I worked 12 hours a day 5 days a week for 200 a week to get a chance to be a broker. I have no pity for people who wont flip burgers to feed a family. Face it natural selection has been upset and the human race is weaker cause of it.

In your original replies, you made no mention of what happens to the 5 children of the woman you would have thrown out on the streets, which is where my concerns lie. As they do with the elderly and disabled. You have now addressed that and, as it turns out, I agree. HOWEVER, I still place much concern on the life of the mother and what can be done to help her out of her situation... which requires understanding how she got there. This is something I feel our system sadly does not support.

I guess I feel passionately about this issue because of how I grew up and what I saw all around me. Absolutely there are people that thrive in that poverty and chaos. But also there are wonderful people that are desperate to get out and sometimes just can't find the path amidst the trash. I feel lucky to be where I am, even though I know I worked extremely hard to find my own way. There are too many people that I left behind that are just as worthy of having what I do.

The powers explicitly defined in the constitution.

Welfare and public assistance is a state issue... If a state chooses to offer it.

It is a not a role for the federal government. It should always be handled on the local/state level.

never said i was stupid. :winkwink:

a bit of a tangent here, but there is a missing piece of this puzzle...while popping out babies you can't afford to feed is obviously wrong and a drain on society, so is spreading your sperm around to every available vagina around.

I don't pretend to be an economic expert and I certainly have no grand plan to rid the nation of welfare abusers, but it seems like perhaps the beginning should involve a better way of holding two people accountable for each child instead of only one, leaving the taxpayers to pick up the slack.

That is absolutely part of the bigger problem and something that desperately needs attention!

debating an age old question that no one will ever agree on.... How do you help those in need without rewarding those who keep putting themselves in that position.

how about this?... if you are a habitual fuckup and mother of 5 always on public assistance, you lose your kids. lets start by making sure there are no incentives to end up in that place to begin with.



AND PLEASE NikKay!!

stop talking about "disadvantaged" or "lucky" or "fortuneate"

its exactly that perspective that does more harm than good. its that perspective that others exploit.

its funny how some guy from vietnam who grew up sleeping in dirt and eating grass and rice can make his way to a new country, build a new life, start a business, bring his family to that country etc... yet some jackass in Brooklyn has all these excuses in the world about how tough life is, how it isn't fair etc.

its not fair that people who do work hard have to pick up the slack for people who don't. its not fair that people who do wake up every day with the singular goal of improving their lives have to pay for those what wake up everyday looking for their next hand out. its not fair that someone who can't afford 1 child... can have 3 or 4 or 6 at the expense of everyone else.

when a town gets hit by a hurricane, its a tragedy and people need help. when some ghetto whore has 7 kids, all by different fathers, then first and foremost, she should lose her kids and she most certainly shouldn't be rewarded for it.

lets not forget that kids are also being punished by being born to a semi-psychotic and selfish whore who has no capicity whatsoever to adequately parent her kids, be a positive role model and teach them anything about life and success.

fathers aren't held accountable for child support?

their wages aren't garnished?

they don't get thrown in jail for not paying child support?

really?

what country do you live in?

I'm not talking about the ones who pay up ( or are made to pay up. ) I'm talking about those who don't.

I have an issue with the fact that because someone decides to not to use judgement or birth control that because of "the children" I am somehow obligated to make sure they are fed clothed etc etc. Where is the encouragement to be responsible if people know they'll get another check coming?


If this woman can't afford to take care of her 5 kids perhaps they need to be put up for adoption. Most likely they'd end up being better off. Staying with mom all they'll learn is how to fuck up and depend on the government for another handout.

Well of course especially since both people involved no matter how poor can get free birth control from the local heath department. However at least in my state women who are on government assistance and have their 2nd baby can get their tubes tied at no cost. I'd rather pay for that than another 2,3 4 kids by her. No such offer is available to men. I'd rather subsidize some guys vasectomy than his 10 kids.

All we have to do is TAKE THE KIDS away and force the bitch to get her tubes tied and have her permanently banned from ANY government services other than job placement. If we're going to be paying for the kids in like foster homes at least give them a shot at being adopted by some people who CAN take care of them. Also to help adoption of these kids put a ban on foreign baby adoption and simply take care of OURSELVES first. Once we run out of babies THEN allow african and chinese babies to be brought in.

As opposed to GW Bush?

You're assuming these women know who the fathers actually are. If the father doesn't work then sure he gets thrown in jail but it's still MY dime paying for his kids and now I'm paying for his incarceration too on top of it. That really doesn't help anything.

I agree with you there but even if they opened a free vasectomy to everyone who wanted one starting tomorrow, how many do you think would go for it? Sadly, I bet very, very few.

Giving her a check is not going to help her. Her problem is that she fucks without protection knowing she's too poor to take care of any babies she makes. She a fucking whore PERIOD. And she's reatrded. Who keeps making babies they can't afford? Can she not say no to sex if she's against birth control?

You're probably right but for everyone who does it saves us money.
Every vasectomy would save $100 for every $1 it cost.

You guys all assume that foster care is a for-profit industry or something! Arrrr? Is everyone here saving up to buy a foster home, so they can get that new benz? heh

Nah, hes light years ahead of Bush... but thats kinda like saying you can run faster than a man with no legs... not really an accomplishment

i am not assuming anything. i didn't make any absolute statements about anything. and i certainly didn't use the words "always", "everytime" and "without exception"

1) if the woman has no clue who the father of her child is...then unless she was raped, she is not fit to be a parent. i would say thats a pretty sound general rule.

Maury Povich devotes an hour everyday on TV to proving that very point.

2) the woman MAKES THE CHOICE TO HAVE A BABY... not the man

3) you are talking about a tiny minority... not the majority of cases. the point is simply that fathers ARE held accountable and pointing out exceptions does not disprove the general rule.

but you're right... it shouldn't be "our problem" when the father is in jail and we shouldn't be subsidizing and rewarding morons for being morons. the fact of the matter is that its not black and white and there are victims, exceptions etc. its a question of doing more harm than good when we do not discourage this behavior.

for me, the problem is that there aren't adequate negative consequences for bad choices and bad behavior. we reward women for shooting future inmates out of their vagina just as fast as they can do it. i think we tolerate far too much when it comes to parents and parenting and the shitty decisions they make and the lives they destroy.

am i the only one to remember welfare reforms? people do abuse and milk the system when they can. the core issue was simply that when you reward poor women for having babies... they have more babies.

The best post in this thread.

Biggest idiot of the thread.

most immature of the thread

Getting nasty when people disagree dont remember calling you names? Free speech thats what the constitution gives us.

Starting this thread caused at least 5 webmasters to get nothing accomplished today. ;)

And it's still going :1orglaugh

Hell knows what they expect from a candidate - one thing is certain - not one of em will deliver. It's like asking which tooth fairy you prefer and expect her to solve all problems :winkwink:

So fucking true. :Oh crap

Bump! Merry Christmas! :d