Im gonna be the 1st sponsor to publicly out paycom. - Page 4 - GoFuckYourself.com

Pleasurepays · 04-09-2006, 03:55 PM

150 broken tours

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quick Buck
hey diesel..

you might want to spend more time working on your sites and less time telling other's how to run their business.

half the images on your tours are broken...

WTF are you talking about

Quote:

Originally Posted by diesel

WTF are you talking about

Juicy D. Links · 04-09-2006, 03:58 PM

hello evry1

Rui · 04-09-2006, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quick Buck

maybe all the PPS programs should start copying mainstream and requiring an invoice and paying on net 60 terms

No check? Sorry, we havent received your invoice.
Sent an invoice? Sorry, we're aren't paying out for February yet.

Hehe, adult has it SO GOOD it's scary.

You make it sound like mainstream is bad

BTW you seem to be a bit outdated regarding the "standart" payment terms

OldSchoolJim · 04-09-2006, 04:40 PM

I have now been on the same side of an argument as quickbuck in 2 separate threads......

circlekhabib · 04-09-2006, 04:53 PM

Quote:

You do make some intresting points, but it wil be a cold day in hell before webmasters accept low PPS payouts

no sheep won't accept low pps payouts.
smart webmasters realize they would make more
with a lower payout with no shave.

Quote:

You blow the industry with 2 prechecked cross sales for years providing shitty content and same feeds everywhere, most of you shave your affiliates to cover your fucked up business and now when you start to get the shit back you complain

it's just a matter of time before the crap epoch allows to bite
them in the ass and
it will be a joyeous day when the hammer drops and see
how many can stay afloat without their cross sale scams
and extreme shave.

bigdog · 04-09-2006, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by circlekhabib

no sheep won't accept low pps payouts.
smart webmasters realize they would make more
with a lower payout with no shave.

it's just a matter of time before the crap epoch allows to bite
them in the ass and
it will be a joyeous day when the hammer drops and see
how many can stay afloat without their cross sale scams
and extreme shave.

About this no shave thing, if shaving is going on I still wind up making more money with PPS programs.

Phil · 04-09-2006, 05:59 PM

what a great post... Got me thinking about paycom

Snake Doctor · 04-09-2006, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quick Buck

not to toot my own horn but this is a great friggin trailer..

super awesome.. props to datatanks as well as the friends of ours who made some cameo appearances

Hun Galleries to Taxicams routinely bring in 100+ joins a day.

http://www.taxicams.com/01/4.php?nats=

Ok i'll stop spamming now. back to the discussion.

Are you willing to put your money where your mouth is?

Give me a gallery (or content + hosting and we'll build the gallery) and we'll run the gallery on the hun in a week and publicly post the numbers on GFY.

If you're anywhere close to 100 joins you'll get more TGP guys pushing you than you can handle, in addition to more traffic from me.

AmateurWealth · 04-09-2006, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lenny2

Are you willing to put your money where your mouth is?

Give me a gallery (or content + hosting and we'll build the gallery) and we'll run the gallery on the hun in a week and publicly post the numbers on GFY.

If you're anywhere close to 100 joins you'll get more TGP guys pushing you than you can handle, in addition to more traffic from me.

If QB passes ...I will take that challenge all day.....i am more than confident in our stats....

RogerV · 04-09-2006, 07:41 PM

Everyone take this moment to see sig and sign up.

their is a surprise inside

StatsJunky · 04-09-2006, 08:35 PM

Instead of soliciting new webmasters and traffic and spending $30,000 for GFY skins, paying $10,000 a month in sig fees and Hummer promotions etc... Why not put part of that money to better use?

Sure you need new affiliates to continue growing your business but what about the ones that are already ACTIVELY promoting you?

I have never in my 6 years of adult affiliate marketing ever had a company offer to help me optimize the existing traffic I was already sending to them. The only help I have received is emails telling me of new hosted galleries they just had built or maybe some new banners and to send more traffic.

What if you spent half of your ad budget on employees that actually spent time helping affiliates individually optimize their existing campaigns. Not just talking about innovative tools, I'm talking about one on one help. Wouldn't that prove more profitable then just increasing your traffic?

In my experience it is much easier to increase your business by optimizing the traffic you already have than soliciting new traffic.

Help your existing affiliates maximize the traffic they're already sending and then start adding new sources.

Tom_PM · 04-09-2006, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StatsJunky

Instead of soliciting new webmasters and traffic and spending $30,000 for GFY skins, paying $10,000 a month in sig fees and Hummer promotions etc... Why not put part of that money to better use?

Sure you need new affiliates to continue growing your business but what about the ones that are already ACTIVELY promoting you?

I have never in my 6 years of adult affiliate marketing ever had a company offer to help me optimize the existing traffic I was already sending to them. The only help I have received is emails telling me of new hosted galleries they just had built or maybe some new banners and to send more traffic.

What if you spent half of your ad budget on employees that actually spent time helping affiliates individually optimize their existing campaigns. Not just talking about innovative tools, I'm talking about one on one help. Wouldn't that prove more profitable then just increasing your traffic?

In my experience it is much easier to increase your business by optimizing the traffic you already have than soliciting new traffic.

Help your existing affiliates maximize the traffic they're already sending and then start adding new sources.

\

It was very gratifying when I logged into our support message board this morning and had a nice private message from an affiliate who I helped last week. I'd checked her sample pages and offered up ways to improve this and that to get more productive clicks, and she said she did and it's been working

Days like today are why I do it

StatsJunky · 04-09-2006, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PR_Tom

\

It was very gratifying when I logged into our support message board this morning and had a nice private message from an affiliate who I helped last week. I'd checked her sample pages and offered up ways to improve this and that to get more productive clicks, and she said she did and it's been working

Days like today are why I do it

I would personally be offering help to my affiliates rather than waiting for them to come. But if you're already backlogged helping the ones that are asking then I guess that is OK too.

Tom_PM · 04-09-2006, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StatsJunky

I would personally be offering help to my affiliates rather than waiting for them to come. But if you're already backlogged helping the ones that are asking then I guess that is OK too.

Thats a good point, and one I did research on another board with some long time people. The general consensus was that even if I surfed their sites, sent personalized emails offering this that and the other, that it would be considered too "spammy". Some said they wouldnt mind as long as it was not boiler plate "Hi, affiliate number X blah blah blah..", but overall it turned me off that idea..

There's a fairly steady stream of people who ask for help. Not all will try the advice, but can't do much more than offer ideas based on the pages they show.

Bake · 04-09-2006, 09:56 PM

First off interesting thread it seems some real issues have been brought up here.
All of us have seen conversions dropping for years now. The survivors have learnt to market better. Look around how many webmasters that are just affiliates have been around longer than just a few years. Therehahaha8217;s not many thathahaha8217;s for sure.
Being just an affiliate (my choice) and being a very good one Ihahaha8217;m still surprised at the way people do business. All I care about is how much I make. Ithahaha8217;s great if you make lots of money as well.
Why do pay site owners want to have thousands of affiliates? Why donhahaha8217;t you just want a few really good guys that can send as many sales as thousands of sheep?

1) Your after a branded image and having thousands of sheep posting all the free stuff you give away and having your images fruskerd hot linked by choice It is all about branding. Your hope is to get your shit all over the net so people see you everyday and hopefully type in your domain one day. I see this as short term as it makes many problems that will detract from sales as sales it provides.
2) You just keep fishing for new affiliates in hope you may catch a whale?

Maybe what you really need is a good affiliate manager someone who knows who the good guys are. One thing for me is the more free stuff you offer the less chance you have of me sending you traffic.
Whathahaha8217;s the point of having great exclusive content and then handing it out to noobs who cant market and just waste it on TGPhahaha8217;s?
Do I really wish to compete with thousands of stupid webmasters who plaster your free everything everywhere.
I donhahaha8217;t need huge payouts or special tours but when I prove to you that I can send real sales work with me. I have one sponsor that pays me extra if I keep up over 100 sales per week. Ithahaha8217;s a deal we both worked out together and we are both happy with.
Once upond a time you had to prove you where a real webmaster before you could even signup to become an affiliate.

If we would like to see conversion rates go back up again maybe just maybe we need to look at the way affiliates are treated and what you give them.

Ihahaha8217;m sure all processors donhahaha8217;t like to have slow sales times as well. They only make money from the commission they charge and no sales means no commission.
Still it dose seem they lie to us most of the time about problems they do have.

Bake · 04-09-2006, 10:07 PM

Re posted without the , '

First off interesting thread it seems some real issues have been brought up here.
All of us have seen conversions dropping for years now. The survivors have learnt to market better. Look around how many webmasters that are just affiliates have been around longer than just a few years. Theres not many thats for sure.
Being just an affiliate (my choice) and being a very good one Im still surprised at the way people do business. All I care about is how much I make. Its great if you make lots of money as well.
Why do pay site owners want to have thousands of affiliates? Why dont you just want a few really good guys that can send as many sales as thousands of sheep?

1) Your after a branded image and having thousands of sheep posting all the free stuff you give away and having your images fruskerd hot linked by choice It is all about branding. Your hope is to get your shit all over the net so people see you everyday and hopefully type in your domain one day. I see this as short term as it makes many problems that will detract from sales as sales it provides.
2) You just keep fishing for new affiliates in hope you may catch a whale?

Maybe what you really need is a good affiliate manager someone who knows who the good guys are. One thing for me is the more free stuff you offer the less chance you have of me sending you traffic.
Whats the point of having great exclusive content and then handing it out to noobs who cant market and just waste it on TGPs?
Do I really wish to compete with thousands of stupid webmasters who plaster your free everything everywhere.
I dont need huge payouts or special tours but when I prove to you that I can send real sales work with me. I have one sponsor that pays me extra if I keep up over 100 sales per week. Its a deal we both worked out together and we are both happy with.
Once upond a time you had to prove you where a real webmaster before you could even signup to become an affiliate.

If we would like to see conversion rates go back up again maybe just maybe we need to look at the way affiliates are treated and what you give them.

Im sure all processors dont like to have slow sales times as well. They only make money from the commission they charge and no sales means no commission.
Still it dose seem they lie to us most of the time about problems they do have.

p1mpdogg · 04-09-2006, 10:08 PM

Quote:

If we would like to see conversion rates go back up again maybe just maybe we need to look at the way affiliates are treated and what you give them.

getting programs to cooperate all together will never happen. thast why programs cant tighten up shit, because the other programs will take that chance to grab more affiliates and end up fucking everything up in the long run.

its sad programs cant unite on anything.

Theo · 04-09-2006, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quick Buck

and half the links on your affiliate page don't function.

jesus man, you're an embarassment to program owners everywhere.

some broken images is the best you can do? Hooper you can do better

I guess RPC scanning n' installing is a dead business these days and we'll have you give a fight for the last ultra super trial that payouts a million dollar letting you a miserly $5

cheers

bigdog · 04-10-2006, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul_Rebel

some broken images is the best you can do? Hooper you can do better

I guess RPC scanning n' installing is a dead business these days and we'll have you give a fight for the last ultra super trial that payouts a million dollar letting you a miserly $5

cheers

$5 profit ain't much if thats what the acutal margins are

TheSenator · 04-10-2006, 09:26 AM

I need a summary please.

Phoenix · 04-10-2006, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray

I have not seen an increase in CB's or a decrease in rebills. I have however see a huge decrease in sales, 30-40%. I'm not talking about just my program (to new to compare), I'm talking about programs that I have been pushing for years.

I have spoken to a couple of large programs and from what I understand there is a POSSIBILITY that we are experiencing another one of those situations where someone is installing some shit on surfers PC's causing join pages to redirect to their program. Just speculation maybe, but it seems to be the only REAL reason ive heard that could be causing this.

Ray

that is my guess as well

Bake · 04-10-2006, 02:21 PM

Bump for a good thread

Rand · 04-10-2006, 02:29 PM

Well.. this has been some read.

Let's dispel a few myths with the facts.

- Epoch does not categorically adjust the scrub up or down across the board. We approach risk management with a scalpel, not a sledge hammer.

- No across-the-board changes have taken place that would affect sign-ups, conversions, rebills, cross-sales, credits or chargebacks.

- A chargeback is initiated at the bank level by the cardholder. Your IPSP is in place to help prevent them but cannot completely stop them.

- Previous ePassporte sign-ups have no affect on chargeback levels.

- Our business model is perfectly aligned with that of our clients. Our job is to help you maintain ratios, remain within all banking rules and regulations, and process as many legitimate sales as possible.

- It is our job to help ensure that programs/clients remain within ratios. If ratios creep toward a questionable level, action is taken to help make sure clients do not get into a fine situation. Secondary sales (cross sales/up sells) would be the first to undergo scrutiny and reflect changes. Primary sales would not be affected except in very extreme circumstances.

- I'm not going to be specific in this statement, but if you do you homework you find that the issue of lower sales, conversions, higher credits, etc... has been industry wide in recent weeks. Any anomalies are not Paycom specific.

BTW - EpicJim probably wins the prize for most intelligent post on this thread. The truth of the matter is a LOT of industry woes might be alleviated if as an industry everyone moved away from PPS programs and moved to rev-share payouts. This would go a long way to cleaning things up.

-

PIMPDOG - After speaking with tech, compliance, and risk management regarding your account, giving you the benefit of a doubt, I believe your post is more about frustration than actual issues. You've been around long enough to know how to run your business appropriately and successfully. Concentrate on that.

Let's just keep things professional so we can all continue making money and leave it at that.

Know that you can contact us/me directly with questions at any time.

aico · 04-10-2006, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand

Well.. this has been some read.

Secondary sales (cross sales/up sells) would be the first to undergo scrutiny and reflect changes. Primary sales would not be affected except in very extreme circumstances.

I have a question. Say I have a cross sale on my join page, and as you say it is under "scrutiny' being a cross sale. If that cross sale fails, will my entire transaction fail with it?

Rand · 04-10-2006, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aico

I have a question. Say I have a cross sale on my join page, and as you say it is under "scrutiny' being a cross sale. If that cross sale fails, will my entire transaction fail with it?

No. Each sale is separate. The most important sale to process (obviously) is the primary sale. It is possible for a primary sale to approve and a cross-sale decline if a cardholders limit has been reached.

aico · 04-10-2006, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand

No. Each sale is separate. The most important sale to process (obviously) is the primary sale. It is possible for a primary sale to approve and a cross-sale decline if a cardholders limit has been reached.

Thanks

OldSchoolJim · 04-10-2006, 03:09 PM

Big ups to RAND for coming out and talking about this.....this always tends to calm webmasters down as the rampant chatter between companies can get out of hand....

p1mpdogg · 04-10-2006, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand

Well.. this has been some read.

Let's dispel a few myths with the facts.

- Epoch does not categorically adjust the scrub up or down across the board. We approach risk management with a scalpel, not a sledge hammer.

- No across-the-board changes have taken place that would affect sign-ups, conversions, rebills, cross-sales, credits or chargebacks.

- A chargeback is initiated at the bank level by the cardholder. Your IPSP is in place to help prevent them but cannot completely stop them.

- Previous ePassporte sign-ups have no affect on chargeback levels.

- Our business model is perfectly aligned with that of our clients. Our job is to help you maintain ratios, remain within all banking rules and regulations, and process as many legitimate sales as possible.

- It is our job to help ensure that programs/clients remain within ratios. If ratios creep toward a questionable level, action is taken to help make sure clients do not get into a fine situation. Secondary sales (cross sales/up sells) would be the first to undergo scrutiny and reflect changes. Primary sales would not be affected except in very extreme circumstances.

- I'm not going to be specific in this statement, but if you do you homework you find that the issue of lower sales, conversions, higher credits, etc... has been industry wide in recent weeks. Any anomalies are not Paycom specific.

BTW - EpicJim probably wins the prize for most intelligent post on this thread. The truth of the matter is a LOT of industry woes might be alleviated if as an industry everyone moved away from PPS programs and moved to rev-share payouts. This would go a long way to cleaning things up.

-

PIMPDOG - After speaking with tech, compliance, and risk management regarding your account, giving you the benefit of a doubt, I believe your post is more about frustration than actual issues. You've been around long enough to know how to run your business appropriately and successfully. Concentrate on that.

Let's just keep things professional so we can all continue making money and leave it at that.

Know that you can contact us/me directly with questions at any time.

yea rand it is and was and still is a post out of frustration. Ive never gotten a solid response from paycom and its always the same one until you posted this.

things like a customer charging back after almost 2 years is kind of questionabe isnt it? they cancelled over a year ago, and the cb just comes in out of the blue? that kinda stuff is pretty odd since i have never seen this happen before. have you?

and yes i have been around long enough to know how to run my business. why do you think i have a back up in place and a backup for that backup when and if you guys decide to ever get squirrely.

oh and dont tell me what to concentrate on. lets keep the sarcasm from an industry professional, professional.

there is clear evidence in this thread that somehing is going on, and its very clear alot are questioning their processors wether it be paycom or someone else.

Aly · 04-10-2006, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EpicJim

Big ups to RAND for coming out and talking about this.....this always tends to calm webmasters down as the rampant chatter between companies can get out of hand....

Agreed. Way to keep things cool.

The Other Steve · 04-10-2006, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempest

in fact I think sunnydollars is the best of the two.. nice good aggressive "upgrade" now prompts and the way they have dates on the content to let the sufer know they upgrade all the time (when they probably don't).. awesome stuff.

Sunny Dollars actually do update their content - new video gets added 4 times a day.

I've been writing a series of reviews for them over the last few months and I do see new videos in there every day.

maxsweet · 04-10-2006, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand

- I'm not going to be specific in this statement, but if you do you homework you find that the issue of lower sales, conversions, higher credits, etc... has been industry wide in recent weeks. Any anomalies are not Paycom specific.

.

Most interesting part of Rand's post.
Anyone who HAS done their homework care to share?

chaze · 04-10-2006, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maxsweet

Most interesting part of Rand's post.
Anyone who HAS done their homework care to share?

other then tax season I have not heard of any trends good or bad that effects the whole industry.

anyone else?

John69 · 04-10-2006, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StatsJunky

Instead of soliciting new webmasters and traffic and spending $30,000 for GFY skins, paying $10,000 a month in sig fees and Hummer promotions etc... Why not put part of that money to better use?

Sure you need new affiliates to continue growing your business but what about the ones that are already ACTIVELY promoting you?

I have never in my 6 years of adult affiliate marketing ever had a company offer to help me optimize the existing traffic I was already sending to them. The only help I have received is emails telling me of new hosted galleries they just had built or maybe some new banners and to send more traffic.

What if you spent half of your ad budget on employees that actually spent time helping affiliates individually optimize their existing campaigns. Not just talking about innovative tools, I'm talking about one on one help. Wouldn't that prove more profitable then just increasing your traffic?

In my experience it is much easier to increase your business by optimizing the traffic you already have than soliciting new traffic.

Help your existing affiliates maximize the traffic they're already sending and then start adding new sources.

Good point, this is a more of a bump and run biz, if they
had to help they would just hire guys and make their own sites.

BluMedia · 04-10-2006, 07:07 PM

Hey Rand thanks for clearing this up. I was wondering what you thought of what I posted earlier?

I would say though that ever since credit card raised the minimum payments and bend over consumers with up to 29% interest things got worse. I had credit cards at 23% at one time and paid more than the minimum payment and my balance went up and I wasn't charging anything. I couldn't imagine having to pay 29%. I think because of this consumers credit cards are maxed out like never before. I checked and just yesterday we had over 100 declines which seems to go up and up. Anyone else see a huge increase in declines? Chargebacks and credits have gone up as well. All of these things tell me consumers have less money avaliable on their credit cards which might be the decrease in sales. Just my

BluMedia · 04-10-2006, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maxsweet

Most interesting part of Rand's post.
Anyone who HAS done their homework care to share?

I would agree with Rand. It doesn't matter what processor is first or second in the cascade the sales are about the same. It does not seem like a processor issue.

Mark

Downtime · 04-10-2006, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manowar

i decided to be contextual

well done!

Rand · 04-10-2006, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BluMedia

Hey Rand thanks for clearing this up. I was wondering what you thought of what I posted earlier?

I would say though that ever since credit card raised the minimum payments and bend over consumers with up to 29% interest things got worse. I had credit cards at 23% at one time and paid more than the minimum payment and my balance went up and I wasn't charging anything. I couldn't imagine having to pay 29%. I think because of this consumers credit cards are maxed out like never before.

I'm sure there are countless reasons why recurring declines might increase and I would venture to say this is indeed a factor. It might add to declines as well as increased cancellations. Unfortuanely I don't know of anyway to measure this and the actual impact is probably negligilbe.

kilotoons · 04-10-2006, 08:24 PM

Very interesting thread about a processor I haven't yet explored.

Tempest · 04-10-2006, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1mpdogg

things like a customer charging back after almost 2 years is kind of questionabe isnt it?

I've only ever done 1 CB and there was a time limit of something like 3 months so how could someone do it after 2 years???

p1mpdogg · 04-10-2006, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempest

I've only ever done 1 CB and there was a time limit of something like 3 months so how could someone do it after 2 years???

yea exactly my thoughts.

rowan · 04-10-2006, 10:32 PM

bump

You really had a chargeback on a 2 year old transaction???

p1mpdogg · 04-10-2006, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rowan

bump

You really had a chargeback on a 2 year old transaction???

yea actually a few of them

mrkris · 04-10-2006, 11:30 PM

Well if anyone here needs a guy to do some sidework helping out affiliates fully utilize their traffic, optimize their sites, etc, hit me up on icq, i love helping people and I love extra work.

bigdog · 04-11-2006, 12:07 AM

nice to see a response from paycom

Rand · 04-11-2006, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1mpdogg

yea actually a few of them

That's something I can check on. I have your company info.

I would have to look into the reg's on this but I believe the maximum amount of time a chargeback might process after a sale can be up to 18 months, but that would be an extremely rare occasion. There might have been a handful of those in nearly a decade of processing.

The issuing banks have a lot of discretion in this area, but it's very rare to see chargeback transactions come back more than six months out and the typical time frame is one to three months. Additionally, with recent security measures such as CVV2 and CVC2 most banks look even closer at disputes.

Rand · 04-11-2006, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1mpdogg

yea actually a few of them

Double post. EDIT

alan-l · 04-11-2006, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DynaSpain

Their rates, system and service has
amazed me in a very positive way.

well, they're amazing, as in AMAZINGLY EXPENSIVE

p1mpdogg · 04-11-2006, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand

That's something I can check on. I have your company info.

I would have to look into the reg's on this but I believe the maximum amount of time a chargeback might process after a sale can be up to 18 months, but that would be an extremely rare occasion. There might have been a handful of those in nearly a decade of processing.

The issuing banks have a lot of discretion in this area, but it's very rare to see chargeback transactions come back more than six months out and the typical time frame is one to three months. Additionally, with recent security measures such as CVV2 and CVC2 most banks look even closer at disputes.

rand id love to get an answer on that.. please folowup with that, i was quite surprised when we saw like 6 of them over the last 3 months duing all this time frame and ratios and shit thats gotten my atention

Troels · 04-11-2006, 01:20 AM

Good post by EpicJim.
Yet almost every program cater to high payout junkies. You've got to wonder who programs target when they launch their $45 per signup, with 2nd page unique counting crap. It just stinks dodgy business to experienced webmasters. The same webmasters who won't be a burden to their support system and will actually send business. Yet they go after the idiots who want their ass wiped 4 times a day for 1 signup a day max.
We send alot of traffic to almost all sponsors and day after day the same program that has low payouts give us the most sales and best value per raw sent. I really don't care what your payout structure is. Just make sure to count EVERYTHING and display accurate incoming hits. Break them down for more analytic value, but have 1st page raw as primary. Guess what, that's what stats are for...
You'll get traffic anyway since we have our own traffic admin program, no need for this usedcar salesman stats manipulation. It stinks.

p1mpdogg · 04-11-2006, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Troels

Good post by EpicJim.
Yet almost every program cater to high payout junkies. You've got to wonder who programs target when they launch their $45 per signup, with 2nd page unique counting crap. It just stinks dodgy business to experienced webmasters. The same webmasters who won't be a burden to their support system and will actually send business. Yet they go after the idiots who want their ass wiped 4 times a day for 1 signup a day max.
We send alot of traffic to almost all sponsors and day after day the same program that has low payouts give us the most sales and best value per raw sent. I really don't care what your payout structure is. Just make sure to count EVERYTHING and display accurate incoming hits. Break them down for more analytic value, but have 1st page raw as primary. Guess what, that's what stats are for...
You'll get traffic anyway since we have our own traffic admin program, no need for this usedcar salesman stats manipulation. It stinks.

epic has always counted 1st page hits, and i might add we have the most accuarte counting system compared to others. ill put our tracking system upto anything any day of the week

04-09-2006, 05:59 PM	#157
Phil Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 7,659	what a great post... Got me thinking about paycom __________________ Ask Phil

04-09-2006, 08:35 PM	#161
StatsJunky Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Checking My Stats Posts: 639	Instead of soliciting new webmasters and traffic and spending $30,000 for GFY skins, paying $10,000 a month in sig fees and Hummer promotions etc... Why not put part of that money to better use? Sure you need new affiliates to continue growing your business but what about the ones that are already ACTIVELY promoting you? I have never in my 6 years of adult affiliate marketing ever had a company offer to help me optimize the existing traffic I was already sending to them. The only help I have received is emails telling me of new hosted galleries they just had built or maybe some new banners and to send more traffic. What if you spent half of your ad budget on employees that actually spent time helping affiliates individually optimize their existing campaigns. Not just talking about innovative tools, I'm talking about one on one help. Wouldn't that prove more profitable then just increasing your traffic? In my experience it is much easier to increase your business by optimizing the traffic you already have than soliciting new traffic. Help your existing affiliates maximize the traffic they're already sending and then start adding new sources. __________________ erik AT suthnet.com

04-09-2006, 09:56 PM	#165
Bake Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Outback of bumfuck Aussie Posts: 5,501	First off interesting thread it seems some real issues have been brought up here. All of us have seen conversions dropping for years now. The survivors have learnt to market better. Look around how many webmasters that are just affiliates have been around longer than just a few years. Therehahaha8217;s not many thathahaha8217;s for sure. Being just an affiliate (my choice) and being a very good one Ihahaha8217;m still surprised at the way people do business. All I care about is how much I make. Ithahaha8217;s great if you make lots of money as well. Why do pay site owners want to have thousands of affiliates? Why donhahaha8217;t you just want a few really good guys that can send as many sales as thousands of sheep? 1) Your after a branded image and having thousands of sheep posting all the free stuff you give away and having your images fruskerd hot linked by choice It is all about branding. Your hope is to get your shit all over the net so people see you everyday and hopefully type in your domain one day. I see this as short term as it makes many problems that will detract from sales as sales it provides. 2) You just keep fishing for new affiliates in hope you may catch a whale? Maybe what you really need is a good affiliate manager someone who knows who the good guys are. One thing for me is the more free stuff you offer the less chance you have of me sending you traffic. Whathahaha8217;s the point of having great exclusive content and then handing it out to noobs who cant market and just waste it on TGPhahaha8217;s? Do I really wish to compete with thousands of stupid webmasters who plaster your free everything everywhere. I donhahaha8217;t need huge payouts or special tours but when I prove to you that I can send real sales work with me. I have one sponsor that pays me extra if I keep up over 100 sales per week. Ithahaha8217;s a deal we both worked out together and we are both happy with. Once upond a time you had to prove you where a real webmaster before you could even signup to become an affiliate. If we would like to see conversion rates go back up again maybe just maybe we need to look at the way affiliates are treated and what you give them. Ihahaha8217;m sure all processors donhahaha8217;t like to have slow sales times as well. They only make money from the commission they charge and no sales means no commission. Still it dose seem they lie to us most of the time about problems they do have. __________________ Buy great domains from drunken burned out old webmaster CHEAP bullseyeporn.com art-met.com and more. Learn how to make a easy extra $500 per week

04-09-2006, 10:07 PM	#166
Bake Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Outback of bumfuck Aussie Posts: 5,501	Re posted without the , ' First off interesting thread it seems some real issues have been brought up here. All of us have seen conversions dropping for years now. The survivors have learnt to market better. Look around how many webmasters that are just affiliates have been around longer than just a few years. Theres not many thats for sure. Being just an affiliate (my choice) and being a very good one Im still surprised at the way people do business. All I care about is how much I make. Its great if you make lots of money as well. Why do pay site owners want to have thousands of affiliates? Why dont you just want a few really good guys that can send as many sales as thousands of sheep? 1) Your after a branded image and having thousands of sheep posting all the free stuff you give away and having your images fruskerd hot linked by choice It is all about branding. Your hope is to get your shit all over the net so people see you everyday and hopefully type in your domain one day. I see this as short term as it makes many problems that will detract from sales as sales it provides. 2) You just keep fishing for new affiliates in hope you may catch a whale? Maybe what you really need is a good affiliate manager someone who knows who the good guys are. One thing for me is the more free stuff you offer the less chance you have of me sending you traffic. Whats the point of having great exclusive content and then handing it out to noobs who cant market and just waste it on TGPs? Do I really wish to compete with thousands of stupid webmasters who plaster your free everything everywhere. I dont need huge payouts or special tours but when I prove to you that I can send real sales work with me. I have one sponsor that pays me extra if I keep up over 100 sales per week. Its a deal we both worked out together and we are both happy with. Once upond a time you had to prove you where a real webmaster before you could even signup to become an affiliate. If we would like to see conversion rates go back up again maybe just maybe we need to look at the way affiliates are treated and what you give them. Im sure all processors dont like to have slow sales times as well. They only make money from the commission they charge and no sales means no commission. Still it dose seem they lie to us most of the time about problems they do have. __________________ Buy great domains from drunken burned out old webmaster CHEAP bullseyeporn.com art-met.com and more. Learn how to make a easy extra $500 per week

04-10-2006, 09:26 AM	#170
TheSenator Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 13,337	I need a summary please. __________________ ISeekGirls.com since 2005

04-09-2006, 03:58 PM	#152
Juicy D. Links So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: N.Y. -Long Island -- Posts: 122,992	hello evry1

04-09-2006, 04:40 PM	#154
OldSchoolJim Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,117	I have now been on the same side of an argument as quickbuck in 2 separate threads......

04-09-2006, 07:41 PM	#160
RogerV Banned! Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 12,591	Everyone take this moment to see sig and sign up. their is a surprise inside

04-10-2006, 02:21 PM	#172
Bake Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Outback of bumfuck Aussie Posts: 5,501	Bump for a good thread __________________ Buy great domains from drunken burned out old webmaster CHEAP bullseyeporn.com art-met.com and more. Learn how to make a easy extra $500 per week

04-10-2006, 02:29 PM	#173
Rand Industry Vet Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Santa Monica, CA Posts: 2,663	Well.. this has been some read. Let's dispel a few myths with the facts. - Epoch does not categorically adjust the scrub up or down across the board. We approach risk management with a scalpel, not a sledge hammer. - No across-the-board changes have taken place that would affect sign-ups, conversions, rebills, cross-sales, credits or chargebacks. - A chargeback is initiated at the bank level by the cardholder. Your IPSP is in place to help prevent them but cannot completely stop them. - Previous ePassporte sign-ups have no affect on chargeback levels. - Our business model is perfectly aligned with that of our clients. Our job is to help you maintain ratios, remain within all banking rules and regulations, and process as many legitimate sales as possible. - It is our job to help ensure that programs/clients remain within ratios. If ratios creep toward a questionable level, action is taken to help make sure clients do not get into a fine situation. Secondary sales (cross sales/up sells) would be the first to undergo scrutiny and reflect changes. Primary sales would not be affected except in very extreme circumstances. - I'm not going to be specific in this statement, but if you do you homework you find that the issue of lower sales, conversions, higher credits, etc... has been industry wide in recent weeks. Any anomalies are not Paycom specific. BTW - EpicJim probably wins the prize for most intelligent post on this thread. The truth of the matter is a LOT of industry woes might be alleviated if as an industry everyone moved away from PPS programs and moved to rev-share payouts. This would go a long way to cleaning things up. - PIMPDOG - After speaking with tech, compliance, and risk management regarding your account, giving you the benefit of a doubt, I believe your post is more about frustration than actual issues. You've been around long enough to know how to run your business appropriately and successfully. Concentrate on that. Let's just keep things professional so we can all continue making money and leave it at that. Know that you can contact us/me directly with questions at any time. __________________ -- Rand Payment Industry - Communications - Quality Assurance Last edited by Rand; 04-10-2006 at 02:32 PM..

04-10-2006, 03:09 PM	#177
OldSchoolJim Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,117	Big ups to RAND for coming out and talking about this.....this always tends to calm webmasters down as the rampant chatter between companies can get out of hand.... Last edited by OldSchoolJim; 04-10-2006 at 03:11 PM..

04-10-2006, 07:07 PM	#184
BluMedia Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Colorado Posts: 3,973	Hey Rand thanks for clearing this up. I was wondering what you thought of what I posted earlier? I would say though that ever since credit card raised the minimum payments and bend over consumers with up to 29% interest things got worse. I had credit cards at 23% at one time and paid more than the minimum payment and my balance went up and I wasn't charging anything. I couldn't imagine having to pay 29%. I think because of this consumers credit cards are maxed out like never before. I checked and just yesterday we had over 100 declines which seems to go up and up. Anyone else see a huge increase in declines? Chargebacks and credits have gone up as well. All of these things tell me consumers have less money avaliable on their credit cards which might be the decrease in sales. Just my __________________ IntenseCash - If you can't convert us then you might want to look for a new job . BrokeStraightBoys.com converting 1:124 stats counted by Nats

04-10-2006, 08:24 PM	#188
kilotoons Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Look for me where it's hot and sunny Posts: 519	Very interesting thread about a processor I haven't yet explored. __________________ Knowledge is Power Ask Me How To make money

04-10-2006, 10:32 PM	#191
rowan Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 17,393	bump You really had a chargeback on a 2 year old transaction???

04-10-2006, 11:30 PM	#193
mrkris Confirmed User Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2,737	Well if anyone here needs a guy to do some sidework helping out affiliates fully utilize their traffic, optimize their sites, etc, hit me up on icq, i love helping people and I love extra work. __________________ PHP-MySQL-Rails \| ICQ: 342500546

04-11-2006, 12:07 AM	#194
bigdog Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,964	nice to see a response from paycom

04-11-2006, 01:20 AM	#199
Troels Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Between the clouds Posts: 1,035	Good post by EpicJim. Yet almost every program cater to high payout junkies. You've got to wonder who programs target when they launch their $45 per signup, with 2nd page unique counting crap. It just stinks dodgy business to experienced webmasters. The same webmasters who won't be a burden to their support system and will actually send business. Yet they go after the idiots who want their ass wiped 4 times a day for 1 signup a day max. We send alot of traffic to almost all sponsors and day after day the same program that has low payouts give us the most sales and best value per raw sent. I really don't care what your payout structure is. Just make sure to count EVERYTHING and display accurate incoming hits. Break them down for more analytic value, but have 1st page raw as primary. Guess what, that's what stats are for... You'll get traffic anyway since we have our own traffic admin program, no need for this usedcar salesman stats manipulation. It stinks. __________________ These guys steal your signups: Read here. And sexsearch.com profit from it. Check out which sponsors pay thieves here. And here's a list of clean sponsors.