Rip

So simple, So why isn't it being done. 99% of people over the age of 18 have some form of identity, credit card, drivers license basic ID, whatever

Slap a bar code on that piece of ID even the most basic warehouse inventory tracking software could manage these ID's, get on a plane, go across the border, the ID is scanned. It would be pretty easy to catch people with fake IDs and people who don't belong

It could also be added to your license plate, rent a car and tell them you are going to georgia, instead your car enters an airport in dallas, a little red flag pops up.

I think we should be doing this, what do you think?

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Vengeance

Absofreakinlutely NOT. Why not just tattoo a bar code on everyone's neck the minute they're born? Not a good idea.

Vengeance

The reason I say that Rip, is because you said a *small* amount of privacy... that's not a small amount. That's pretty much all of it.

TaDoW

for the sake of argument .. our Social Security Numbers are pretty much barcodes ... although I agree that we shouldn't be tracked like that. It's just not cricket ... and we would pretty much throw most of our privacy out the window. Plus, can you imagine the problems it would bring for those trying to cheat on their wives????

X-raid

I agree with you Vengeance...
Don't you Rip want a camera on me so you can see when I take a shit too...

We want privacy and we want more of it!

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I can kill you, so fuck off!

Vengeance

Sorry man, but giving up our freedoms and RIGHTS to privacy is not the way to defend it. Ever.

TaDoW

actually uhm .. there's no real 'right' to privacy established in the constitution .. learned all about it in a law class this summer :-(

Rip

so you are in favour of the terrorists being able to move freely back and forth across the Canada US border, and being able to board airplanes with bought identification?

X-raid

If that's your solution Rip, then yes I guess I'm in favor...


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I can kill you, so fuck off!

TaDoW

if we take away our freedom, they've won. period. I'm not all for that, I think we need to be a bit more strict in our controls on airports .. perhaps set up an international authority to handle it.

I'm willing to give up some rights .. like body x-rays at airports, etc ... but being tracked everywhere you go seems a bit excessive.

Vengeance

Listen up... I am in favor of ME being able to move freely. I am in favor of YOU being able to move freely. And I am NOT willing to give that up because of a bunch of asshole terrorists.

The minute you start passing out and giving up our freedoms like freakin' candy, there will be no end to it.

What's next? Maybe we should limit the type of work people can do? Limit WHERE they can go? Limit WHEN they can go there? Sounds alot like communism to me.

JakeR

What the fuck..
how is having a barcode on an ID such a big "invasion of privacy"

I flew in from vegas this morning, maybe 40 people on the entire plane, hell only 3 in biz. class. We need tighter security measures so people can feel a little less stressed out about all this shit.

A lot of people are scared shitless, and I wouldn't mind having a barcode on my ID if it means there's more security and safety for myself.

Rivux

Its not like it cant be tracked where we go now anyways, who cares if its a barcode or not. Anyone that uses, debit cards, bank machines or credit cards is essentially be tracked, they know where you were and when. And how often would we need to use the bar code? moving between states, countries, boarding planes? Doesnt seem to be that big of deal

X-raid

JakeR, people gets stressed when they know that "big brother" is watching them all the time!!!

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I can kill you, so fuck off!

12clicks

Jack, I'd tell you but if you're asking this question, you won't understand anyway.

JakeR

Trust me I'll understand if you have a point, and it's Jake.

Kimmykim

I'm totally against any suspension of or giving up of individual rights.

I flew to Dallas and back last weekend -- as soon as they resumed flying -- and wasn't scared one bit. Keep in mind that the WTC hijackers didn't have anything illegal with them when they came thru security.

I'd be willing to bet there's not an American commercial airliner jacked again in the next ten years, not successfully. Even if a guy said he had a bomb the passengers would beat the fuck out of him since they wouldn't have much to lose...

X-raid

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I can kill you, so fuck off!

Rivux

After that picture I have having fantasies of Jessica Alba, excuse while I go and relieve myself

kane

have any of you ever read the book " brave new world" ?

The barcode is the first step. Of course the book takes things like that to the extreme and it is meant to be as much a satire as a statement of loss of freedom, but overall I think it's very prophetic

12clicks

jake, jack, whatever. when you don't understand one of the core values of our country, what's a name matter?

Rivux

12clicks - you never stop amazing me.

Freedom, just like beauty is in the eye of the beholder. What is freedom to one person is oppression to another. I think some people are willing to go the route of barcodes of some kind to feel safer.

Vengeance

I am flat amazed at how easily people are willing to just give it all up. After all we've fought for... after all the speeches & protests, declarations and last ditch efforts... after all the blood spilled in the very name of freedom itself... you'd just give it all up. Just like that. Just so you can *feel* a little bit safer on your trip to Disneyworld.

That is truly the saddest thing I've ever heard. Because you're not safer.

You're just less free than you were yesterday.

Kimmykim

What kind of drugs are you doing today???

Vengeance

And this.... is quite possibly the single most ridiculous statement ever made.

Kimmykim

Eh, probably not the single most, but it would make a Letterman top ten list without a problem...

Keev

i THINK A VERY VERY MINUTE AMOUNT FOR NATIONAL SECURITY ISSUES ONLY!

JakeR

Don't give me that 'core value' bullshit if carnivore and echelon are already known to be in full swing right now.

I'm going to 2 CLOSED casket funerals on monday for life-long freinds of mine that were working at the Morgan Stanely offices during the attack.

I'm sure they, along with the other 6000+ dead wouldn't have minded giving up certain privacy issues.

kane

I was watching VH1 last night and rebecca rankin was driving across country from LA to New York and took a film crew with her. She had to stop for security at the hoover dam. They police there told her to turn off the camera. When she came back on they were turnning around as were several other cars and said it was because they were told they were suspicious and could not cross the dam as they may be a threat to it. So they hid the cameras, waited a while and went back, but one other family in an RV still couldn't get across it. So they live in this country but because they were in an RV or "looked suspicious" they couldn't go across the dam. I understand that this is probably only for the short term until we get things under wraps but a little freedom given up could be a limit on where you could go.


what if your barcode was rejected for some unknown reason. Well, looks like no vacation or trip or whatever for you.

Rip

Interesting discussion

I throw this into the fire for thought

Your personal private information is currently being bought and sold, right now, for profit... without your knowledge

You have credit cards, bank loans etc... your credit history, financial status, what you make, what your (financial) liabilities are swapped back and forth across major banks, credit card companies, department stores... just for a few

did you ever wonder how American Express, for example.. "pre approved" you for a credit card, when you never had one of their cards before

Go into your bank and pay off your credit card balance, pay off your car loan a couple of months early, or bump up your mortgage payment

Wait 2-3 weeks and see how much junk mail that you get from different banks and credit card companies offering you a loan, maybe even a few phone calls

Your medical files and health information is being shared already between health insurance companies, life insurance companies

...any moron with half a brain and a phone can find out your credit history and tons of personal information, in just a few minutes, all without your permission

so your private information is already being bought and sold... it's too late for that

Kimmykim

"did you ever wonder how American Express, for example.. "pre approved" you for a credit card, when you never had one of their cards before"
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Sorry Rip, read the fine print. You're only pre-approved as long as you qualify and you have to give them permission to do a credit check that actually shows payment history.

For example, my TEN YEAR OLD just got his third pre-approved Visa APPLICATION in the mail. He has no freaking credit, no source of income and therefore wouldn't qualify to get a card from them. But somehow his names gotten on a list, most like coming from his receiving skateboarding magazines in his own name, and now he's PRE-APPROVED lol.

Credit bureaus have sold names and addresses for years but they don't sell the line item records. And one of the big three just got dragged through court over selling that much information.

"...any moron with half a brain and a phone can find out your credit history and tons of personal information, in just a few minutes, all without your permission"
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You offering?

Rip

Well all I can say is, you'll find out

There was an TV expose on this very thing about a year and a half ago,

the banks' explanation for this sharing of your financial information is that when you put your signature beside the "x" there was a little line in the fine print that specified they were allowed to "use" this information

The big question was not if they were doing it or not, rather if buying and selling of this information among financial entities was within the terms of the individual's credit/loan application.

So I am not trying to pull your leg, it's being done, if you haven't seen it happen to you or someone you know, probably one day, you will. Maybe unfortunately if you don't think it's happening

Deposit cash in the bank? Cash deposits over specified amounts are automatically flagged and referred to specific federal tax departments.

Kimmykim

"Deposit cash in the bank? Cash deposits over specified amounts are automatically flagged and referred to specific federal tax departments."
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Actually any cash transaction over 10,000 dollars is reported to the IRS. Go buy a car, win big in Vegas, get caught at Customs and it gets reported among others.

Rivux

No drugs for me Kimmy. For some people a barcode would be infringing on their freedom, while to others it would not be. Whats so hard to understand that different people think of freedom as different things.

Edit: I had to make some spelling changes due to some pretty awful spelling. Hopefully its fixed now

[This message has been edited by Rivux (edited 09-21-2001).]

Warphead

I'm gonna quote a little Ben Franklin here and say

"He that would sacrifice liberty for safety deserves neither."

But I don't really consider someone checking my id a threat to my privacy.

angleaous

if you start wareing barcodes and shit
like that then your giving in to the
terrorists and they've won

do you think its what everyone in the world wars fought for no they fought and died for freedom fuck barcodes kill the fucking terrorists then we all can feal safer and wouldn't need to talk about barcodes

Rip

Where did it say wearing a bar code?

My initial suggestion, was to have a bar code on your ID and your license plate

If a cop pulls you over they can already input your license # through the radio

I suspect within a couple of years you will see a mag strip or something on your ID, drivers license, whatever, a bar code does not demagnetize, thats all

if you walk into an airport, and take a flight, they are going to have a database to check you anyway
I can't understand people that are paranoid about having your ID checked at an airport or border crossing

Vengeance

California already has bar codes on our licenses. It's not new.

Sorry, not bar codes, mag strips.

[This message has been edited by Vengeance (edited 09-22-2001).]

Rose

Not my privacy.
But I am all for more security at the border
and airports.Also immigration policies should change.

Rip

Yeah the system they got for checking fake ids and illegal immigrants now, works pretty darn good doesn't it?

Rose

Sure does Rip
They catch guy with fake passport, but
they let him go an bail, instead putting him
on first plane back home

Vengeance

How's this for a new system then Rip:

Enter the country with a fake passport, go to prison. Go directly to prison. Do not pass Go. Do not collect a green card. And spend the next 90 years making big rocks into little rocks.

Sounds like a plan to me.

JakeR

good plan

iceyone

I did not read this whole thread but I believe the technology is called a smart card?????

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Rip

Yeah the guy they caught a couple years ago crossing the border into Port Angeles, with the homemade explosives is his car, was just lucky to have been caught by an alert customs officer

I heard that he was denied refugee status, but was collecting welfare while he waited

The sad part is the 'security' people the airlines hire are lucky if they make minimum wage, and get 1/1000th of the training of a customs officer

UnseenWorld

Rip:

I guess I don't understand why a bar code can't be copied, stolen, or misappropriated just the same way a credit card or passport can. What can a bar code do that is so speciaL?

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Blondy

great idea.

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12clicks

Jack, I didn't want you to think your melodramatics scared me away.

The under educated in our society always think its a good idea to give something up in return for security. (they aren't bright enough to come up with plans like the ones Rose proposes. Her idea my not be perfect but its a whole lot better than having law abiding citizens of the US give up their privacy so that we can continue to let murderers into our country.

Andy S

this idea might come out to be true after all...

[url=http://www.drudgereport.com/id.htm[/url]

Andy S

click

sorry