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Old 05-20-2002, 11:38 PM  
Brad Mitchell
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Southfield, MI
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MY RANT!! Cogent Bandwidth and Hosting Economics.

This shit cracks me up. Below is my hosting rant... If you host on a server with Cogent bandwidth you might learn something about economics and the proponderance of false advertising in the hosting business if you read this.

There is good and bad in everything - there are good hosts, there are bad hosts. Sure, sometimes shit happens to good hosts. Bad hosts have shit happening all the time. This is not directed at any one company in particular.

You usually get what you pay for. All of the large affiliate programs use bandwidth provided by companies like Level 3, Verio and the like. There is a reason for that, it's better bandwidth. They also pay more for management and hardware. Why? All that stuff costs moola. If all you're doing is TGPs then I suppose Cogent bandwidth is fine with triple the latency, just hope they don't go out of business or you're fucked.

A lot of hosting companies advertise falsely all the time. You're never going to see your server - you don't know what the fuck you're hosted on. So, if you're paying $200 per month and your host is telling you that you're hosted on a dual processing server with 1 gig of ram and SCSI hard drives he's probably a lying motherfucker.

To add insult to injury, many hosts that advertise redundant bandwidth don't have it. Take, for example, anyone that sells Cogent. There is not a single company selling Cogent represented here on GFY that has 1000mbits from Cogent and 1000mbits from a Verio or Level 3 as a backup. I bet there isn't even one that has 100mbit from each of two providers. The reason is simple: 100mbit from Cogent is $3000, 10mbit from a Verio or Level 3 is $3000. DO THE MATH. You can't sell bandwidth for .50 or even 1.00 per gig if you have to pay both providers - the cheap one as primary and the expensive for backup.

Of course dedicated hosting is optimal. However, based on sheer numbers I'd bet most people in the adult business are doing virtual hosting. It's easy to tell someone to do dedicated hosting but if they're building their business chances are virtual hosting is the better value. Just because dedicated is 'cooler' then virtual doesn't excuse hosts that sell virtual hosting to unsuspecting webmasters and deliver shoddy performance. Here too, you get what you pay for. If you're paying $50 per month for 100 gigs you're bound to have a bad experience. Can virtual hosting be a great option? Absolutely!!

Again, do the math. If 100mbit from Cogent costs $3000 and the host is selling for .50 per gig he's got a theoretical 30,000 outbound gigs that he can sell (assuming 10% of the traffic is inbound). If a host sold all 30,000 gigs at .50 each he'd gross $15,000. That, minus his hard costs of $3000 for his 100mbit from Cogent and approximately $700 for a full cabinet (because you have to pay for space in a colo facility)... EXCEPT, you can't sell 'ALL' of your available bandwidth or you have a bunch of pissed off customers. Why? Well, anyone hosting that doesn't use MRTG graphs doesn't realize that your peak bandwidth utilization is upwards of twice your average. What does this all mean? If you sell 50mbit of bandwidth you better have a 100mbit pipe so that you can accomodate your customers peaks and valleys without losing packets and network performance. When a network tops out, everything gets delayed.

And where are we now? Well, if you have a host with a 100mbit pipe from Cogent he's paying $3000 for that and if he uses one cabinet in the facility (space for 40 1U servers) add about $700 in rent (average). He can only sell 50% for great performance or maybe as high as 70% if he's lucky. Here's the math at a 50% sell through: $7500 - $3000 - $700 = $3800/month as a gross profit. If he's selling you dedicated hosting, he's got margin on the server rent and management. If he's selling you virtual hosting, those hardware and management costs are straight up out of his bottom line.

So what can you possibly get for .50 per gig? Well, if you're virtual hosting you're going to be on a shit box that's overloaded. In general you're going to be lucky if your host has expensive routers, switches and hubs. You're also going to be lucky if you're in a proper hosting facility with 24-7 security, proper fire supressiom, raised flooring, proper HVAC and redundant power to the facility. Oh, and speaking of hardware, you're going to be lucky if your server is actually plugged into a UPS. What can you expect from this hypothetical host in terms of support? Well, if his best case gross-net is $3800 per month... YOU CAN'T HIRE A NETWORK ENGINEER FOR $35,000 PER YEAR, LET ALONE 3 OF THEM FOR 24 HOUR SUPPORT. Chances are there are no employees, just contractors and friends that do favors. If the server 'rent' and 'management' fees aren't very high then you're really playing russian roulette. If they're low do the math - price out your server as they have it spec'd. Example? $300 per month for a server = $3600 per year. A dual processing server with dual IDE drives and 1 gig of ram is at about $2000 if it's a name brand server like a Dell or Compaq. If it was built by the host, who the fuck would want that? Shitty hardware is another discussion so go fuck yourself tightass. So, this host has $1600 per year in gross profit on your account, or $133 per month to pay for installation, maintenance, upgrades and network emergencies.

That's some real hypothetical math... However, I'm sure there are alot of experienced hosts out there that would agree I'm not too far off the mark for this size hosting operation. What's my point to all of this? Well, currently many of you are enjoying cheap bandwidth and I think that's great. You better hope that the companies out there selling the pipe don't go out of business because you'll be back to paying $2-$3 per gig. Cogent isn't profitable and since they're undercutting all the Tier 1 providers nobody wants to give them peering arrangements anymore. What else? I find that most hosts selling shitty bandwidth also have a shitty network infrastructure, crappy hardware and false advertising about redundant bandwidth.

So, good luck to all of you! In as much as you all BITCH and MOAN on this board about paying NOTHING for hosting most of the guys making bank are paying good money to their hosts. Is that a coincidence? You be the judge. I laugh every time I see someone on here making fun of a host for charging more than $2 per gig. You get what you pay for.

The differences between cheap and expensive hosting is generally not like going to the grocery store and getting Frosted Mini Wheats versus the Generic brand. We all know those two cereals are made in the same factory... but the difference between cheap ass hosting and average hosting prices are typically indicative of two entirely different product and service offerings.

Why is it so important that something like Cogent stay in business? Well, if they don't virtually all of you big TGP posters would be hard pressed to make a nice profit. Conversions are shit and you need to give away a gigs just to get a sale. If you had to pay an aggregate of $5-6 per gig (includes: bandwidth, hardware, management) you'd at least be a lot less profitable.

In closing, just because you need cheap hosting to make your business model work and accept compromises on the quality and performance of your hosting - that doesn't mean the rest of us are in the same boat. When you run paysites, an affiliate program, a search engine, or any site that gets bookmark traffic you need to spoil your surfers with good performance... that costs money.

I can't wait to see all the disgruntled replies. Show me the money! Point out to me all the big companies that use Cogent bandwidth. Of all the people that exhibit at the Internext shows, whose products are hosted on this bandwidth? Live Feeds? Content Plug-Ins? Pay Sites? Guess what, they're all paying more for hosting then .50-1.00 per gig and you probably couldn't switch them over if you begged them. Does this cheap hosting work for alot of you? Absolutely! And, I hope it continues to go well. I just thought I'd enlighten a few of you about the REAL world of hosting economics. Perhaps you'll have a few new questions to ask next time you're shopping for a host.





Cheers!

Brad
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