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Confirmed User
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 75
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Resolving the Kina Kai issue (read before working with her)
For the record, I'm not going to respond to any comments on this. There's not a point. I won't respond to emails or phone calls because I have better ways to spend my time. I just want to move on to better things.
My commentary
I used to think a partnership with a model was a good idea. After further review, it's a bad idea, because most models don't understand the amount of work that goes into doing a site, and think that if they spread their legs, the subscriptions will come. Adult webmasters know this is not necessarily the case, and also know that talent is a commodity. As someone I know said, "Every day, new models are turning 18."
I didn't comment on this 1) because I was too busy to worry about it, and 2) the one thing I have learned from previous lives is defending yourself on a message board is pointless. Only a couple of people here actually know who I am, and frankly, the impact on site traffic pulling some of the links has been negliable. Why bother joining in throwing shit with people who are insistent on dragging your name in the dirt?
If another webmaster wants to work with her, read through the rest of this, and consider the mob mentality that has been fostered on this message board and other message boards by the active parties -- working with someone that considers posting the comments like what was posted I wouldn't do. I'm sure someone else will, but I would consider getting everything in writing with her and negotiating with her before actually starting a site with her. I do wish her the best going forward, but urge her to consider what it really takes to do it right.
For matters of resolving this, I have FedEx'ed all the content to her, including photos and digitized video on DVD. I did take her site down, and I will work with CCBill to transfer the subscriptions. I'm not going to transfer any more payments because quite honestly, her site generated about 70 subs, and at this point, I would be asking for money to cover for uncharged hosting costs.
Why I didn't respond
Between starting a new full time job, ending a 7-year relationship that's been more like a divorce, having to move, and general depression, the last thing I want to deal with was the site. Some things should take priority over other things.
Why I didn't want to continue the partnership with Kina
I thought everything was okay until two days before site launch (which, for the record, was a week earlier than planned). We had agreed earlier on a 50/50 split of all proceeds of the site verbally, but she decided she wanted to renegotiate, and after final discussions back and forth (most of which I agreed with because I was just tired), most of the revenue was going to her. Most of this is documented through IM threads because she didn't want to discuss these issues over the phone (which, of course, explains why I didn't want to answer her phone calls). After this, she suggested that it was a client relationship (in another IM thread). As you can imagine, that pretty much lead to why I soured over the relationship.
I was mislead in how much she could promote the site, and what her fan base was.
For example, Word Tracker results are for the following models:
Francine Dee - 3579
Akira Lane - 1037
Kina Kai - 175
Ange Venus - 72
There are about 5 to 7 other models on another site I run that drive more keyword traffic than she does.
My costs
We split location costs and MUA costs. She wanted to factor in costume/wardrobe costs, even though she appears in some of the same wardrobe items on other sites. I probably spent (lost) over $1,500. My labor costs for the time was probably over $10,000 if I factor in lost time that I could have spent consulting. During attempts to do custom shoots, she demanded usage of my video equipment (equipment that typically rents for $150 per day).
The work split
I had to edit the video, edit the photos, upload the photos, submit to TGPs, work on SEO, submit to sites because Kina sent me a list. She posted on a blog, and posted to about half a dozen messages boards. Someone else record
For the record, I have log files, so I have a pretty good idea where I posted links and she did.
What does she own?
Technically, she doesn't own anything. U.S. Copyright Law states that it goes to the creator (photographer or designer), which means she owns no rights to the site design, photography, may own some rights to the video but used equipment I own to shoot it, and doesn't own the site programming. I will be sending some of the data (including mailing lists) to her in a zip file, but she will have to go elsewhere to set up another site -- the fact that she doesn't have a site now is not my responsibility.
I'm not going to fight the copyright issue now. Use the photos however you want.
She does own the domain name, has access to switching the DNS, and I will be sending a complete list of subscribers so she can appeal to them to subscribe to the new site -- whenever she sets that up.
I'm done with this. Remember, not going to bother commenting. Take it or leave it.
Good luck, and good night.
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