Obama asking for 5.5 billion to give to insurance companies

[crockett]

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

I'm pretty sure the majority of the people in this thread who are unhappy with ACA:

(a) are not Republicans
(b) voted for Obama at least once

Do you have an opinion on how to have affordable healthcare in America or are you just a pom-poms person?

There is no real reason to debate the specifics of the topic as I mentioned it's just another blame Obama post by Vend. It doesn't matter how many of these topics are started he never listens to any reason.. When ever we prove with out a doubt he is wrong in any of these topics, he just disappears popping up with yet another Fox News induced rage fest about what ever the current bitch and moan is this week..

I asked a simple question, what have Republicans done to help bring us more affordable health care or make ACA better. You seem to be worried about the govt spending money.. How much tax dollars do you think Republicans have wasted trying to repel ACA now for the 50th time?

If this is all about saving money, giving better Heath care and not just bitching and moaning about Obama, then why don't they bring forward proposals on how to fix the issues? Again if it's all about saving then why is ACA the only thing they talk about? Why is it just billions of subsidies to insurance companies that Republicans don't like?

Why is it not the billions of dollars that go to Boing? Dow Chemical and the billions of govt subsidies that get handed out each year like candy to 100's of other fortune 500 companies? Why just bitch and moan about ACA when there are far bigger fish to fry?

Also the title is very misleading. It attempts to make the impression that he is just handing out 5.5 billion to insurance companies which is far from true. It's always been part of the law to help subsidize the insurance companies the first few years. This is nothing new or added. It's part of the total cost.

This is not however a actual amount but rather a line of credit "if" needed. Nothing maybe needed at all, or perhaps a small amount of the 5.5 billion.. It's very unlikely that the entire 5.5 bil will be needed but he still has to ask for it.

Again just more misleading and attempts of fear mongering.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Nothing wrong with healthcare? Really?

Healthcare costs are going up faster then cost of living raises - People are making less every year because their healthcare costs up faster than their salary does. This of course doesn't mentioned millions of people - such as my wife - with pre-exisiting conditions...

Seriously, where do you get this from?

Wow, great cherry picking, you forgot the " it was making it affordable "

So when are you going to agree you were wrong about palin making the statement I can see Russia from my House?"

Originally Posted by deltav

This is a brain flailing around with the issues without really grasping anything, and then spouting out some half-baked phrases and vague opinions heard on the radio or something. I swear you could almost program a bot to write this stuff.

Sounds like what most people say when they have no answers

Originally Posted by Rochard

But my point is it wasn't political parties.

The Republican party, at the state level, passed a law about healthcare and it seems to have worked. When Democrats copied the law and applied it to the state level, Republicans did everything in the power to shoot it down- and the continued to fight it after it became a law.

Maybe if we Mitt in office we wouldn't have had half the issues we this bill.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100723888

"Since Romneycare, costs for employers have gone up at least five percentage points over the national average," Marathas said. "There's administrative costs, premium costs, and it all ads up. We really need to focus on that, and these laws don't in my opinion."

Originally Posted by kane

I can't say what Romney would or would not have done as far as the economy goes had he won. However, had he won I can say with 99% certainty what would have happened as far as the ACA and healthcare reform. . . nothing. Zero. Zilch. Nada. The republicans weren't talking about this prior to the election. This was never on their radar. The democrats forced the conversation during the election. Then when Obama began pushing the ACA the republicans were asked how they would better handle it. They had no answer.

Maybe nothing would have been better than what we have. As I have said, the ACA actually works for me, but I also understand that for many others it does not.

I am of the opinion that some kind of radical change in our healthcare system will need to take place or eventually it will crush the middle class. Most people and families are one serious illness or injury away from bankruptcy and financial ruin. When the largest cause of personal bankruptcies in the nation are due to medical bills and most of those who end up in bankruptcy have health insurance, it it is a sure fire sign that things are going in the wrong direction.

The ACA doesn't help the problem because it does nothing to reduce costs. But lets not fool ourselves into thinking that the republicans would have come up with a better plan.

I think a better plan would be one that doesn't include 5.5 billion pay day for insurance companies

[crockett]

Also the funny thing about this whole 5.5 billion is republicans have already had mud on their face about this so why is it even being brought up again?

House Republicans earlier this year considered legislation that would repeal the risk corridors. Those plans were dropped after the Congressional Budget Office said on Feb. 4 that the health law?s programs to reduce risk for insurers, including risk corridors, would save the government $8 billion over the next 10 years.

Then of course in the same budget, there is the $402 billion that the govt will save over the next 10 years by the reduced spending for Medicade thanks to ACA and the insurance markets..

The same piece of news about the 5.5 billion but with a little less shock jock attempt to get page views from a banner farm website...

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-0...5-billion.html

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by deltav

Nah, crockett is pretty much right on about the OP's motivation for starting the thread (going from past history), I think he was just frustrated hearing the same old schtick.

That aside, it's a discussion worth having. Will be very interesting to see how things play out.

Crocket is frustrated because I put him on ignore, that and his sex life living in a van.

the president wanting to give 5.5 billion to the insurance companies is a worthy subject to discuss

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Crocket is frustrated because I put him on ignore, that and his sex life living in a van.

the president wanting to give 5.5 billion to the insurance companies is a worthy subject to discuss

You have always ignored the facts, so what else is new?

[Barry-xlovecam]

$1.75 trillion Total healthcare spend
$1,750,000,000,000.00
- $5,500,000,000.00 <= Subsidy

"[i]ncluded $5.5 billion in potential payments to insurance companies that suffer losses as result of the Affordable Care Act. ..."

That is a whopping 0.00314 (0.31429%)

Talk about a tempest-in-a-teapot.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

$1.75 trillion Total healthcare spend
$1,750,000,000,000.00
- $5,500,000,000.00 <= Subsidy


That is a whopping 0.00314 (0.31429%)

Talk about a tempest-in-a-teapot.

So 5.5 billion here 5.5 billion there, so what?
It adds up

[Vendzilla]

Here are some of the new taxes that are because of Obamacare

$123 Billion: Surtax on Investment Income (Takes effect Jan. 2013): A new, 3.8 percent surtax on investment income earned in households making at least $250,000 ($200,000 single)

$86 Billion: Hike in Medicare Payroll Tax

$65 Billion: Individual Mandate Excise Tax and Employer Mandate Tax

$60.1 Billion: Tax on Health Insurers

$32 Billion: Excise Tax on Comprehensive Health Insurance Plans

$23.6 Billion: “Black liquor” tax hike

$22.2 Billion: Tax on Innovator Drug Companies

$20 Billion: Tax on Medical Device Manufacturers

$15.2 Billion: High Medical Bills Tax

$13.2 Billion: Flexible Spending Account Cap – aka “Special Needs Kids Tax”

$5 Billion: Medicine Cabinet Tax

$4.5 Billion: Elimination of tax deduction for employer-provided retirement Rx drug coverage in coordination with Medicare Part D

$4.5 Billion: Codification of the “economic substance doctrine”

$2.7 Billion: Tax on Indoor Tanning Services

$1.4 Billion: HSA Withdrawal Tax Hike

$0.6 Billion: $500,000 Annual Executive Compensation Limit for Health Insurance Executives

$0.4 Billion: Blue Cross/Blue Shield Tax Hike


http://jeffduncan.house.gov/full-lis...care-tax-hikes

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Wow, great cherry picking, you forgot the " it was making it affordable "

Well, it is more affordable. It's cut my insurance costs in half. It's cut one of my friend's healthcare costs by 3/4.

Healthcare costs keep going up and something needs to be done. One of my friends makes less money every year - She works for the state government, has had a wage freeze for some time now, yet her healthcare costs keep going up. Something has got to give here.

This is very simple. We took a Republican plan put into place by a Republican governor that seems to be working... Yet ironically the Republican is bitching like little children who didn't get their way. IF MITT WAS PRESIDENT RIGHT NOW YOU WOULD ALL BE BACKING THIS WITH HARDONS.

I'm not saying Obamacare is good or bad; Clearly it's had it's problems. The biggest problem here is what the Republican party has been doing and how they have been handling it. Their only interest to date has been defeating what has now become a law.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

So when are you going to agree you were wrong about palin making the statement I can see Russia from my House?"

What exactly did she say?

"They're our next-door neighbors, and you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska, from an island in Alaska"

She implied that she would be able to handle negotiations with Russia because "They are her neighbor". Sure sure.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

"Since Romneycare, costs for employers have gone up at least five percentage points over the national average," Marathas said. "There's administrative costs, premium costs, and it all ads up. We really need to focus on that, and these laws don't in my opinion."

I think a better plan would be one that doesn't include 5.5 billion pay day for insurance companies

Blah blah blah do you not understand that costs are going to up NO MATTER WHAT? We can do nothing, and healthcare costs are going to up. And employers should shoulder the bulk of the costs for healthcare.

98% of residents in MA have insurance thanks in part to Romenycare. Seems to me it's working exactly as planned.

[Robbie]

@crockett:
You keep asking about "what have Republicans done"

Who cares? This isn't about Republicans.
This is about a Democrat Party law. Passed 100% by Democrats and backed 100% by Democrats (until the elections come that is...then they are running from it).

You could also ask this: Bush did a huge power grab with The Patriot Act. What have the Democrats done after 5 years in power to fix THAT?
Answer: They put it on steroids and abused it even more.

Again...why don't YOU just stop acting like this is a team sporting event. It's not.
The ACA is turning out to be a nightmare for the country. People still don't have a good national environment for employment (after 5 years of "recovery"). And the U.S. is 17 TRILLION dollars in debt.

People with your attitude of "Democrat VS Republican" are the reason that the bureaucrats and lifetime/career politicians in Washington D.C. continue to get away with fucking us all up the ass.

Again...it's not Vendzilla that is the subject of this thread. It's not Republicans who are the subject of this thread.
YOU are trying to DEFLECT away from the real issue being brought up and do a bunch of name-calling.

Either add something to the subject or shut the fuck up and go make a new thread entitled: "Everything Is GREAT! It's Just Vendzilla And Republicans Whining"

Then you and Mark Prince can post over and over in it and feel good about things. Kind of like your own version of MSNBC. lol

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Well, it is more affordable. It's cut my insurance costs in half. It's cut one of my friend's healthcare costs by 3/4.

Healthcare costs keep going up and something needs to be done. One of my friends makes less money every year - She works for the state government, has had a wage freeze for some time now, yet her healthcare costs keep going up. Something has got to give here.

This is very simple. We took a Republican plan put into place by a Republican governor that seems to be working... Yet ironically the Republican is bitching like little children who didn't get their way. IF MITT WAS PRESIDENT RIGHT NOW YOU WOULD ALL BE BACKING THIS WITH HARDONS.

I'm not saying Obamacare is good or bad; Clearly it's had it's problems. The biggest problem here is what the Republican party has been doing and how they have been handling it. Their only interest to date has been defeating what has now become a law.

How can you blame the republicans for something they had nothing to do with? How is that a problem?

What exactly did she say?

"They're our next-door neighbors, and you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska, from an island in Alaska"

She implied that she would be able to handle negotiations with Russia because "They are her neighbor". Sure sure.

She didn't say what you said she said, you were misquoting her

Blah blah blah do you not understand that costs are going to up NO MATTER WHAT? We can do nothing, and healthcare costs are going to up. And employers should shoulder the bulk of the costs for healthcare.

98% of residents in MA have insurance thanks in part to Romenycare. Seems to me it's working exactly as planned.

Funny how you say Republicans are to blame for the problems, then say a Republican was responsible for Obamacare, you need to make up your mind

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Robbie

@crockett:
You keep asking about "what have Republicans done"

Who cares? This isn't about Republicans.
This is about a Democrat Party law. Passed 100% by Democrats and backed 100% by Democrats (until the elections come that is...then they are running from it).

You could also ask this: Bush did a huge power grab with The Patriot Act. What have the Democrats done after 5 years in power to fix THAT?
Answer: They put it on steroids and abused it even more.

Again...why don't YOU just stop acting like this is a team sporting event. It's not.
The ACA is turning out to be a nightmare for the country. People still don't have a good national environment for employment (after 5 years of "recovery"). And the U.S. is 17 TRILLION dollars in debt.

People with your attitude of "Democrat VS Republican" are the reason that the bureaucrats and lifetime/career politicians in Washington D.C. continue to get away with fucking us all up the ass.

Again...it's not Vendzilla that is the subject of this thread. It's not Republicans who are the subject of this thread.
YOU are trying to DEFLECT away from the real issue being brought up and do a bunch of name-calling.

Either add something to the subject or shut the fuck up and go make a new thread entitled: "Everything Is GREAT! It's Just Vendzilla And Republicans Whining"

Then you and Mark Prince can post over and over in it and feel good about things. Kind of like your own version of MSNBC. lol

Why I have him on ignore. This thread has nothing to do with Republicans and Democrats, what it has to do with it that Obama wants to give 5.5 billion to the insurance companies. If this is such a good law, why does he have to do that and why is he pushing back my things inside the law, which Paul Rand is suing Obama over saying it's unconstitutional to do that!

[MK Ultra]

Originally Posted by Rochard

And employers should shoulder the bulk of the costs for healthcare.

Clearly a troll, I wasn't 100% sure until I saw that comment

So in your world employers should be responsible for worker's health?

Then I take it you agree with the company who fired all the smokers in their employ? That really happened a few years ago http://www.cbsnews.com/news/smokers-...ot-apply-here/

Hey that's only fair right? If the employer is responsible for paying then shouldn't they be able to mandate behavior to reduce costs?

So no more weekend drinking! It's bad for you, and if you don't lose 25 pounds by October you'll be put on a diet or terminated!
We'll also need to check what's in your refrigerator, your wife and kids are included on the plan and their health is our responsibility too so they need to all shape up!


Health insurance was offered as an incentive by employers as a way to attract workers during the wage freezes of world war two, it was totally voluntary until the ACA made employers responsible, that's (just) one of the things that causes opposition and will cause some big changes in how people are hired in the future.

Picture one of these in every Human Resources Office across the country

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

How can you blame the republicans for something they had nothing to do with? How is that a problem?

This is Republican idea that became a law passed by a Republican governor who nearly became president of the United States. If this was Mitt Romney passing Romneycare the entire Republican party would be singing it's praises.

You are missing the point here. This is no longer about Obamacare. This is about the Republican party failing to support a bill (which is fine) but then doing everything they can to sabotage it and even going so far as to bring this all the way Supreme Court. What is the end goal here - to defeat this? That would be loose / loose for everyone - Billions wasted, years wasted, and the American public gets fucked because it STILL doesn't have a healthcare law.

This is what the Republican party fails to see. Even if they win this battle, it will ONLY be a win for their party and no one else.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

She didn't say what you said she said, you were misquoting her

It's called a joke. Clearly you've lost your sense of humor.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Funny how you say Republicans are to blame for the problems, then say a Republican was responsible for Obamacare, you need to make up your mind

I do blame this on the Republican party. This is a law passed by a Republican in MA and it's working there with 98% coverage. The only reason the Republican party isn't praising Obamacare is because it's not Romenycare - if the name was different, the Republican party would be 100% behind it.

I don't recall the Republican party taking Romneycare to the Supreme Court.

Congress is no longer concerned about the American people and what's right. They want a win for their party, not the American people.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by MK Ultra

So in your world employers should be responsible for worker's health?

Yes, I do believe the employer should be fiscally responsible for their employee's health for multiple reasons.

Happy and healthy employees are more productive as opposed to having a percentage of employees out sick every day or out of work for long term because they don't have healthcare insurance.

Do I think a company can fire people who smoke? No, of course not. But it's in the company's best interests to promote a healthy lifestyle and have healthy employees.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Rochard

This is Republican idea that became a law passed by a Republican governor who nearly became president of the United States. If this was Mitt Romney passing Romneycare the entire Republican party would be singing it's praises.

And what does this have to do with the OP, wait I know, nothing

You are missing the point here. This is no longer about Obamacare. This is about the Republican party failing to support a bill (which is fine) but then doing everything they can to sabotage it and even going so far as to bring this all the way Supreme Court. What is the end goal here - to defeat this? That would be loose / loose for everyone - Billions wasted, years wasted, and the American public gets fucked because it STILL doesn't have a healthcare law.

This is what the Republican party fails to see. Even if they win this battle, it will ONLY be a win for their party and no one else.

So the republicans are making Obama ask for 5.5 billion dollars to give to the insurance companies?

It's called a joke. Clearly you've lost your sense of humor.

Until I pointed it out, you thought it was the truth

I do blame this on the Republican party. This is a law passed by a Republican in MA and it's working there with 98% coverage. The only reason the Republican party isn't praising Obamacare is because it's not Romenycare - if the name was different, the Republican party would be 100% behind it.

I don't recall the Republican party taking Romneycare to the Supreme Court.

Congress is no longer concerned about the American people and what's right. They want a win for their party, not the American people.

Why would state law be taken to the supreme court, the answer is it wouldn't be taken there.


Ok, you want a comparison , fine, Romney care is probably working because the bill was only 70 pages long

the ACA law is 381,517 words
add on the regulations, it comes to approximately 11,588,500 words of final Obamacare regulations
These 109 final regulations account for a combined 10,535 pages in the Federal Register, where the government officially published them.



http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/...s-30x-long-law


Still want to compare the two?

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/...s-30x-long-law

Wow!

And THAT is how Washington D.C. "works".

That kind of mentality is why nobody has yet to read the whole damn thing.

And the tax law is about as bad. I have had to have a CPA do my taxes since 1998 because it's just too insane to try and do it when you own your own business.

I don't see how ANYBODY...even Crockett...can possibly think that a law with that many goddamn words and pages can ever be anything but bloated and inefficient.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Robbie

@crockett:
You keep asking about "what have Republicans done"

Who cares? This isn't about Republicans.
This is about a Democrat Party law. Passed 100% by Democrats and backed 100% by Democrats (until the elections come that is...then they are running from it).

You could also ask this: Bush did a huge power grab with The Patriot Act. What have the Democrats done after 5 years in power to fix THAT?
Answer: They put it on steroids and abused it even more.

Again...why don't YOU just stop acting like this is a team sporting event. It's not.
The ACA is turning out to be a nightmare for the country. People still don't have a good national environment for employment (after 5 years of "recovery"). And the U.S. is 17 TRILLION dollars in debt.

People with your attitude of "Democrat VS Republican" are the reason that the bureaucrats and lifetime/career politicians in Washington D.C. continue to get away with fucking us all up the ass.

Again...it's not Vendzilla that is the subject of this thread. It's not Republicans who are the subject of this thread.
YOU are trying to DEFLECT away from the real issue being brought up and do a bunch of name-calling.

Either add something to the subject or shut the fuck up and go make a new thread entitled: "Everything Is GREAT! It's Just Vendzilla And Republicans Whining"

Then you and Mark Prince can post over and over in it and feel good about things. Kind of like your own version of MSNBC. lol

Robbie you always argue the same mute point as if just because a democrat is president it somehow gives republicans in congress the abitly to do whatever they want or to do nothing at all.

You are as bad as Vend is with that kind of mentality. Anyone with even half a brain understands its matters quite a lot what Republicans do being they control the house.

Honesty it becomes very hard to take your arguments seriously when you don seem to think anything the republicans do matters but democrats and obama you blame for everything.

Also MSBN really? Do you think I have cable in my Westy as I'm traveling around the country? Even at home I don't watch any 24hr news networks...

[Barry-xlovecam]

$0.6 Billion: $500,000 Annual Executive Compensation Limit for Health Insurance Executives

I see, so Health Insurance Executives will be *DEPRIVED* of maybe $2 Billion in annual compensation and the US Treasury will be deprived of $0.6 Billion!

Makes perfect sense now

Less campaign contributions? Hidden agenda?

$123 Billion: Surtax on Investment Income (Takes effect Jan. 2013): A new, 3.8 percent surtax on investment income earned in households making at least $250,000 ($200,000 single)

Investment Income? Most individuals have their investment income in tax deferred retirement accounts. When they use the principal amounts and earnings in their retirement they will pay the current ordinary income tax rate on the withdraws.

So that makes no change for 95% of the public. They must be wailing over at Solomon Brothers .... An additional 3.8% is horrid -- all kidding aside I doubt that 5% will have real suffering.

Will most of us will be affected by the Medicare Payroll or SE tax increase?

$86 Billion: Hike in Medicare Payroll Tax

There is no wage base limit for Medicare tax. All covered wages are subject to Medicare tax.

Beginning January 1, 2013, Additional Medicare Tax applies to an individual?s Medicare wages that exceed a threshold amount based on the taxpayer?s filing status. Employers are responsible for withholding the 0.9% Additional Medicare Tax on an individual?s wages paid in excess of $200,000 in a calendar year, without regard to filing status. An employer is required to begin withholding Additional Medicare Tax in the pay period in which it pays wages in excess of $200,000 to an employee and continue to withhold it each pay period until the end of the calendar year. There is no employer match for Additional Medicare Tax. For more information about the Additional Medicare Tax, see our questions and answers.

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc751.html
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p15.pdf Page 2

Hook, line and sinker ...

If your AGI is $400K+ you are getting hit. Crocodile tears are flowing.

Giving Healthcare Insurers a subsidy is lame. Having a private based Healthcare system is lame. Having privately owned prisons is lame. Corporate managed human required services is lame.

There is a place for private enterprise but by allowing private enterprise to manage the services that are basic to society you people that claim stubborn independence, myself included, suffer the most.

We are just being played.

[Robbie]

Again, crockett...The Affordable Health Care Act is not affected by the Republicans in Congress at all.
Did they try to stop it? Yes.
Did they? No.

The Pres. did not allow ANY Republicans to have any input into writing it. Not one Republican voted for it.

And yes, they oppose it.

And NO, it doesn't matter "quite a lot" that the Republicans control the House in 2014.

If so how? What have the Republicans been able to do to change that law?

NOTHING.

The only person changing the law is President Obama.

You keep saying that I have a "mentality" of blaming the Pres. for what he is ACTUALLY DOING.

WTF?

If he is doing it...then YES he is to "blame".

Your "mentality" on the other hand seems to be that you cheerlead the "Democrat" team against the "Republican" team.

You just can't get it in your head that this is not a football game. And you don't have a "team".

These are ALL bureaucrats who have made their careers (and fortunes) off the govt. teat.

You are still deflecting.

Why don't YOU address the ACA and the changes that the Pres. has personally made to it (without Congressional approval...he is just changing the law in whatever way he wants to).

Why don't YOU explain to all of us WHY the Pres. is pushing to give 5.5 billion dollars to the Insurance Companies when "ObamaCare" was supposed to fix everything?

Come on.
Tell us why this whole gigantic mish-mash of a law that nobody has ever even read isn't working?

The Republicans are to blame? Really?
And probably Bush too, right?

[AmeliaG]

Originally Posted by crockett

There is no real reason to debate the specifics of the topic as I mentioned it's just another blame Obama post by Vend. It doesn't matter how many of these topics are started he never listens to any reason.. When ever we prove with out a doubt he is wrong in any of these topics, he just disappears popping up with yet another Fox News induced rage fest about what ever the current bitch and moan is this week..

I asked a simple question, what have Republicans done to help bring us more affordable health care or make ACA better. You seem to be worried about the govt spending money.. How much tax dollars do you think Republicans have wasted trying to repel ACA now for the 50th time?

If this is all about saving money, giving better Heath care and not just bitching and moaning about Obama, then why don't they bring forward proposals on how to fix the issues? Again if it's all about saving then why is ACA the only thing they talk about? Why is it just billions of subsidies to insurance companies that Republicans don't like?

Why is it not the billions of dollars that go to Boing? Dow Chemical and the billions of govt subsidies that get handed out each year like candy to 100's of other fortune 500 companies? Why just bitch and moan about ACA when there are far bigger fish to fry?

Also the title is very misleading. It attempts to make the impression that he is just handing out 5.5 billion to insurance companies which is far from true. It's always been part of the law to help subsidize the insurance companies the first few years. This is nothing new or added. It's part of the total cost.

This is not however a actual amount but rather a line of credit "if" needed. Nothing maybe needed at all, or perhaps a small amount of the 5.5 billion.. It's very unlikely that the entire 5.5 bil will be needed but he still has to ask for it.

Again just more misleading and attempts of fear mongering.

I mentioned my objection to corporate welfare, regardless of industry, but where did I say anything about the government spending money?

If you think there is no point discussing the issues associated with Americans getting healthcare, are you only in this thread to say "Democrats are better than Republicans" with no interest in exchanging perspectives? Making fun of Republicans is not going to mend a single broken arm or provide a single course of antibiotics for a sick person. As a result, I find it boring and an excuse to evade the important issues.

I shared a couple of options for what I think would be better for providing healthcare properly to all Americans. What is your solution?

[AmeliaG]

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

...
Giving Healthcare Insurers a subsidy is lame. Having a private based Healthcare system is lame. Having privately owned prisons is lame. Corporate managed human required services is lame.

There is a place for private enterprise but by allowing private enterprise to manage the services that are basic to society you people that claim stubborn independence, myself included, suffer the most.

We are just being played.

I'm really glad you made the private prisons analogy. I think it is very apt. If there is one service government should provide, it is firehouses, but, if there are two, I'm going with firehouses and law enforcements including prisons.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Why I have him on ignore. This thread has nothing to do with Republicans and Democrats, what it has to do with it that Obama wants to give 5.5 billion to the insurance companies. If this is such a good law, why does he have to do that and why is he pushing back my things inside the law, which Paul Rand is suing Obama over saying it's unconstitutional to do that!

You have me on ignore because you freaked out about me posting a video called Tokyo Breakfest in one of your other topics and somehow concluded that I was personally attacking your daughter. Where you came up with that one is well beyond me. I don't talk about family members and I rarely troll people. You being really the only real exception, because you just endlessly post the same mindless shit over and over.

Look we all get it, you hate Obama. If you had any ability at all to make reasonable conversation that included give and take it wouldn't be a big deal. You however constantly call people names that don't don't agree with and then try to act as if somehow you are better than everyone else while you sit at home sucking up your unemployment.

Get a job do something with your life and quit watching Fox News all day..it's warped your mind.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Wow!

And THAT is how Washington D.C. "works".

That kind of mentality is why nobody has yet to read the whole damn thing.

And the tax law is about as bad. I have had to have a CPA do my taxes since 1998 because it's just too insane to try and do it when you own your own business.

I don't see how ANYBODY...even Crockett...can possibly think that a law with that many goddamn words and pages can ever be anything but bloated and inefficient.

I'm sure either Crockett or Richard will figure out a way.

I actually learn alot in these threads, because I hear things, so I look them up to see if they are true.

I learn from people like you and Amelia has always been a great poster to read.

All the BS GOP vs Democrats has made up my mind, I registered as a Libertarian and intend to stay that way. I'm not against either side, just the administration that has a weak leader that has pushed thru a bad law full of ways to fund the health insurance companies into the next several decades.

Crockett can't argue one time without blaming the Republicans and Richard can't even admit he was wrong about the statement that he misquoted Palin with

[crockett]

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

I mentioned my objection to corporate welfare, regardless of industry, but where did I say anything about the government spending money?

If you think there is no point discussing the issues associated with Americans getting healthcare, are you only in this thread to say "Democrats are better than Republicans" with no interest in exchanging perspectives? Making fun of Republicans is not going to mend a single broken arm or provide a single course of antibiotics for a sick person. As a result, I find it boring and an excuse to evade the important issues.

I shared a couple of options for what I think would be better for providing healthcare properly to all Americans. What is your solution?

I didn't mean there wasn't a debate about fixing ACA or working on creating better healthcare system. What I was saying is as far as Republicans are considered there is no debate, the only option they even talk about is defeating ACA, yet they have nothing to replace it with and offer up no solutions.

Me asking what the Republicans can do to solve the issue is a valid point. I'm sorry but if they are going to critique it all day long what is their alternative? Really that's what this topic is about it's yet another bitch and moan attempt to tell everyone ACA is broken. So what is their idea for a solution? It's simple they don't have one but it's sure as hell pretty easy to bitch at others who actually try to do something.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

Giving Healthcare Insurers a subsidy is lame. Having a private based Healthcare system is lame. Having privately owned prisons is lame. Corporate managed human required services is lame.

There is a place for private enterprise but by allowing private enterprise to manage the services that are basic to society you people that claim stubborn independence, myself included, suffer the most.

We are just being played.

Seeing national forests being managed by private companies pisses me off to no end.

I've spent probably over 20 years in northern California and seeing fees go up to just park in a national forest because of a private company managing it makes me mad.

Here's just a few
http://www.oregonlive.com/environmen...manage_ba.html

http://mcmorris.house.gov/news-relea...e-forest-site/

http://www.clm-services.com/

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Again, crockett...The Affordable Health Care Act is not affected by the Republicans in Congress at all.
Did they try to stop it? Yes.
Did they? No.

The Pres. did not allow ANY Republicans to have any input into writing it. Not one Republican voted for it.

And yes, they oppose it.

And NO, it doesn't matter "quite a lot" that the Republicans control the House in 2014.

If so how? What have the Republicans been able to do to change that law?

NOTHING.

The only person changing the law is President Obama.

You keep saying that I have a "mentality" of blaming the Pres. for what he is ACTUALLY DOING.

WTF?

If he is doing it...then YES he is to "blame".

Your "mentality" on the other hand seems to be that you cheerlead the "Democrat" team against the "Republican" team.

You just can't get it in your head that this is not a football game. And you don't have a "team".

These are ALL bureaucrats who have made their careers (and fortunes) off the govt. teat.

You are still deflecting.

Why don't YOU address the ACA and the changes that the Pres. has personally made to it (without Congressional approval...he is just changing the law in whatever way he wants to).

Why don't YOU explain to all of us WHY the Pres. is pushing to give 5.5 billion dollars to the Insurance Companies when "ObamaCare" was supposed to fix everything?

Come on.
Tell us why this whole gigantic mish-mash of a law that nobody has ever even read isn't working?

The Republicans are to blame? Really?
And probably Bush too, right?

As I already mentioned the insurance subsidy was already part of the law. I've already posted that but you have ignored it. There was always a safety net for the insurance companies for the first few years. It's nothing new and even as I already posted Republicans even dropped the issue when it was shown the govt would get the money back in a $8 billion dollar savings over 10 years.

This is really only being made a big deal because it's a easy way to bitch and moan about Obamacare. It's a dead issue even by the GOP's standards.

Btw in a previous post you and vend both claimed that I never stay on topic. I want to remind you of the last political post i started about John McCain being censured by the crazy Arizona tea party members. You couldn't jump in the topic fast enough to tell the whole world about Joe Lieberman. You and Vend both had a gay sex orgy shitting all over the topic not once even committing on the topic at hand. As I said in that topic, it's funny that it's ok for you two to derail other people's topics but you don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by crockett

Me asking what the Republicans can do to solve the issue is a valid point. I'm sorry but if they are going to critique it all day long what is their alternative? Really that's what this topic is about it's yet another bitch and moan attempt to tell everyone ACA is broken. So what is their idea for a solution? It's simple they don't have one but it's sure as hell pretty easy to bitch at others who actually try to do something.

I saw on the news today that there are 20 different Republican proposals.

Neither the President, or Sen. Harry Reid have shown any interest in even looking at those proposals.

The Pres. won't even MEET with members of Congress about it...or even take a phone call from them.

This is all about a "legacy" for Pres. Obama and the Democrat Party.

Unfortunately, the "legacy" may turn out to be a very bad one.

So now that you have your answer...how about YOU contributing to the discussion instead of just constantly bashing Vendzilla and spewing vitriol about the GOP?

Shouldn't Pres. Obama and the Democrats who all voted "for the law before they read it" be the ones "Fixing" it?

And yet, all we see them doing is scrambling to give out exemptions to every big company and union.

crockett...for God's sake...open your eyes and put aside your political bias for just a minute.

EDIT: Just saw your last post. In response to you bringing up the Arizona post you made: The only reason I pointed out what the Dems had done to Lieberman is because your post insinuated that Republicans are "crazy" for censuring McCain. I pointed out that what you were saying was BULLSHIT because both parties had censured members before. The most recent famous one being Joe Lieberman being run out of the Democrat Party when they tried to "Primary" him.
Crockett...come on. You are spinning in circles here.

As for the "Insurance Subsidy" being part of the law...Who knew? Nobody has read that fucking thing. It's too big.
And if that is the truth...then Pres. Obama was lying through his teeth when he said it wouldn't cost "one thin dime".
That is NOT what the American people were sold during the campaign of 2012.
We were all deceived. Plain and simple.

[Vendzilla]

Today, Sebelius said that policies will go up in 2015.

President Obama famously promised in 2008 and 2009 that his health insurance overhaul plan would lower the cost of health care for an average family by $2,500 per year.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...l-mandate.html

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Robbie

I saw on the news today that there are 20 different Republican proposals.

Neither the President, or Sen. Harry Reid have shown any interest in even looking at those proposals.

The Pres. won't even MEET with members of Congress about it...or even take a phone call from them.

This is all about a "legacy" for Pres. Obama and the Democrat Party.

Unfortunately, the "legacy" may turn out to be a very bad one.

So now that you have your answer...how about YOU contributing to the discussion instead of just constantly bashing Vendzilla and spewing vitriol about the GOP?

Shouldn't Pres. Obama and the Democrats who all voted "for the law before they read it" be the ones "Fixing" it?

And yet, all we see them doing is scrambling to give out exemptions to every big company and union.

crockett...for God's sake...open your eyes and put aside your political bias for just a minute.

EDIT: Just saw your last post. In response to you bringing up the Arizona post you made: The only reason I pointed out what the Dems had done to Lieberman is because your post insinuated that Republicans are "crazy" for censuring McCain. I pointed out that what you were saying was BULLSHIT because both parties had censured members before. The most recent famous one being Joe Lieberman being run out of the Democrat Party when they tried to "Primary" him.
Crockett...come on. You are spinning in circles here.

As for the "Insurance Subsidy" being part of the law...Who knew? Nobody has read that fucking thing. It's too big.
And if that is the truth...then Pres. Obama was lying through his teeth when he said it wouldn't cost "one thin dime".
That is NOT what the American people were sold during the campaign of 2012.
We were all deceived. Plain and simple.

Crockett has his head in the sand and doesn't realize that the GOP has always had plans. Here's the one that has everyone's attention and from what I have read, makes more sense that what we have now

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...ace-obamacare/

It has some really good stuff in it and of course is being ignored by the present administration.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

So the republicans are making Obama ask for 5.5 billion dollars to give to the insurance companies?

You can either lead, follow, or get the fuck out of the way.

The Republican party didn't lead. They really should have; Mitt passed a similar law so this is something Republicans should be able to get behind. They should have lead the way and supported it.

The Republican party surely didn't follow.

And the Republican party didn't get out of the way either. Instead of doing their jobs, they did the direct opposite - and interfered at every step of the way. Even AFTER it became a law the Republican party continued to to fight it.

The Republican party let us down. Again.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Until I pointed it out, you thought it was the truth

No, I know exactly what the truth is. I'm pretty confident I knew it before you told me. Palin - and even more so with Bachman - are fucking crackpots. I love it when they open their mouths, I really do.

Palin the other day sat up there on her pedestal and told us how more people are un-insured now than before Obamacare. She lied.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Why would state law be taken to the supreme court, the answer is it wouldn't be taken there.

Massachusetts has it's own Supreme Court. Why didn't any of the Republicans in Massachusetts, or any of the Republican Congressmen or Senators from Massachusetts complain or file a lawsuit?

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Ok, you want a comparison , fine, Romney care is probably working because the bill was only 70 pages long

I can see where making a federal law which has to comply with all fifty states could be a little bit more complicated as opposed to a bill for only one state.

It's disappointing that the federal version is so complicated. Perhaps if the Republican took the lead here it might have been much different.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Rochard

You can either lead, follow, or get the fuck out of the way.

The Republican party didn't lead. They really should have; Mitt passed a similar law so this is something Republicans should be able to get behind. They should have lead the way and supported it.

Why when it's a bad law?

The Republican party surely didn't follow.

And the Republican party didn't get out of the way either. Instead of doing their jobs, they did the direct opposite - and interfered at every step of the way. Even AFTER it became a law the Republican party continued to to fight it.

The Republican party let us down. Again.

Republican party is representing their base

No, I know exactly what the truth is. I'm pretty confident I knew it before you told me. Palin - and even more so with Bachman - are fucking crackpots. I love it when they open their mouths, I really do.

Palin the other day sat up there on her pedestal and told us how more people are un-insured now than before Obamacare. She lied.

So it's ok for you to misquote her? Which you did, you lied if you already knew what she really said!

She was going by all the people that lost their policies recently, she was wrong. But she isn't even a politician. The politician that lied was Obama when he said "if you like your insurance, you can keep it"

Massachusetts has it's own Supreme Court. Why didn't any of the Republicans in Massachusetts, or any of the Republican Congressmen or Senators from Massachusetts complain or file a lawsuit?



I can see where making a federal law which has to comply with all fifty states could be a little bit more complicated as opposed to a bill for only one state.

It's disappointing that the federal version is so complicated. Perhaps if the Republican took the lead here it might have been much different.

So you are finally agreeing they are not the same? BTW, the Republicans did try, they were ignored by Obama.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Crockett has his head in the sand and doesn't realize that the GOP has always had plans. Here's the one that has everyone's attention and from what I have read, makes more sense that what we have now

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...ace-obamacare/

It has some really good stuff in it and of course is being ignored by the present administration.

It's funny, for someone that has me on ignore you sure have a lot to say about me,. lol

[Vendzilla]

Richard, you keep blaming the Republican party in this thread about Obama wanting to give 5.5 billion to the insurance companies.

So you agree that Obamacare is not working if they need more money?

[Robbie]

Oh well...I guess the deflecting and doing ANYTHING except addressing the topic of the post has worked.

The "Obama-Maniacs" have turned it into another thread that ignores Obama Care and turns it into attacking anybody that doesn't get in line and conform to the Democrat Party line.

So I guess I'm out of here.

There was some interesting discussion before the thread got "MSNBC'ed"

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Oh well...I guess the deflecting and doing ANYTHING except addressing the topic of the post has worked.

The "Obama-Maniacs" have turned it into another thread that ignores Obama Care and turns it into attacking anybody that doesn't get in line and conform to the Democrat Party line.

So I guess I'm out of here.

There was some interesting discussion before the thread got "MSNBC'ed"

Yeah, that's what they always do. I'm going offline for the rest of the day. I decided that I'm joining the VFW tonight during a meeting. Plus trying to put together a new entertainment center for the bigger TV we got. So far so good on that, LOL

Rochard has been blaming the Republicans for something that has nothing to do with the thread and you have been trying to tell the same thing to Crockett, but it's not taking, he's not bright enough.....

Getting ready to go to China, when I get back, have to start working on a new project that will let porn stars and cam models advertise for free. Looking forward to that.

Laters

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Oh well...I guess the deflecting and doing ANYTHING except addressing the topic of the post has worked.

The "Obama-Maniacs" have turned it into another thread that ignores Obama Care and turns it into attacking anybody that doesn't get in line and conform to the Democrat Party line.

So I guess I'm out of here.

There was some interesting discussion before the thread got "MSNBC'ed"

Robbie you claim I'm biased but you are just as bad or worse.. You claim Republicans shouldn't have to fix anything but guess what they are the ones complaining non stop. I hate to break it to you but ACA works fucking awesome for me.

I've worked for myself almost all my life and almost all my adult life I've had no insurance because it cost too much money for a policy for myself and cost vs benefits were not worth while so I've paid out of pocket almost all my life for any medical expenses.

When the economy took a shit I'm not afraid to say I wasn't doing so well and I took a job for the last three years up until the start of this one. I needed the job for the first year to get by, but after that I was doing ok again but I got used to having insurance. I kept the job til this year to keep the insurance and stayed up in New England all that time.

Now with Obamacare, having health insurance is not tied to having a job that provides a affordable plan. I'm now traveling around the country and guess what I have health insurance and my cost is cheaper than what I was paying for prior while still working.

So you can complain all day long but it works for me. Is it perfect? No, I'd rather have a Single payer system, but this works for now.. So when you say Republicans shouldn't have to fix anything.. Well if they think it's broken then yes they should fix it and quit whining all the time.

[Robbie]

Yes crockett...you are right...I hear and obey.

I will ignore all the things going bad.
I will ignore the FACT that it was the Unions and Democrats who shoved healthcare costs down employers throats to begin with...and now claim they are "liberating" people from being "forced" to work a job for the insurance because the economy sucks and people can't get a job to begin with.

I will be assimilated. Resistance is futile. I will bow down to Sen. Harry Reid, I will bow down to Congresswoman Pelosi. And I will follow Pres. Obama

I will no longer question the Federal Govt. allowing Big Pharma and Big Medical Corp. to price gouge and scam the American people.
I will accept that it is the way it MUST be from now on. And it is my duty as an American to make the Insurance, Medical, and Pharma Corp. much, much richer so that they can continue to funnel money to the wise and loving Senators and Congressmen in Washington D.C. who know what is good for me.

I will conform. I will obey.
We are all crockett. We do not want the artificially high health care cost scam to end. We want the prices to stay high so that we can have socialized "single pay".

I will hate Vendzilla. And I will hate Amelia G. And I will hate anybody who disagrees.

Republicans are the "Party Of No". Republicans are EVIL. This is all George Bush's fault.

I will obey.

[AmeliaG]

Originally Posted by crockett

Robbie you claim I'm biased but you are just as bad or worse.. You claim Republicans shouldn't have to fix anything but guess what they are the ones complaining non stop. I hate to break it to you but ACA works fucking awesome for me.

I've worked for myself almost all my life and almost all my adult life I've had no insurance because it cost too much money for a policy for myself and cost vs benefits were not worth while so I've paid out of pocket almost all my life for any medical expenses.

When the economy took a shit I'm not afraid to say I wasn't doing so well and I took a job for the last three years up until the start of this one. I needed the job for the first year to get by, but after that I was doing ok again but I got used to having insurance. I kept the job til this year to keep the insurance and stayed up in New England all that time.

Now with Obamacare, having health insurance is not tied to having a job that provides a affordable plan. I'm now traveling around the country and guess what I have health insurance and my cost is cheaper than what I was paying for prior while still working.

So you can complain all day long but it works for me. Is it perfect? No, I'd rather have a Single payer system, but this works for now.. So when you say Republicans shouldn't have to fix anything.. Well if they think it's broken then yes they should fix it and quit whining all the time.

How much does your health insurance cost?

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

How much does your health insurance cost?

Do not question Brother Crockett Amelia G.

Doing so proves that you are racist and defending Republicans.

Stop resisting. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
Praise be to Lord Obama and the Collective.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Richard, you keep blaming the Republican party in this thread about Obama wanting to give 5.5 billion to the insurance companies.

I don't spend my free time whacking off to Fox News or Republican sites. I haven't read much about this, but of course you are making a big deal about something that is minor. Your Republican based websites picked a number from the budget and made it sound horrible: "Obama to give insurance companies $5.5 Billion". Sounds horrible.

But then factor in the reduction in costs to Medicaid and Medicare - $400 billion in the next decade. (Seriously, did you know we spend $300 billion a year on Medicaid and Medicare? Fuck me with a broom handle.)

Then note we'll be spending $15 billion on training new doctors over the next decade.

Whatever, it's the budget. You can pick apart any budget and say "Why did we spend that?". In this case, the Obama administration is no better than the Bush administration, or the administration before that, the administration before that one, and every administration before and so.

I'm still waiting for an explanation on why Bush paid out a cool $1 billion to Filipino families who had family members that fought the Japanese during World War II.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

So you agree that Obamacare is not working if they need more money?

No, I do not agree. Seems to me this was part of the plan. Ween Americans off of Medicare and Medicaid, a $300 billion a year expense, and compensate insurance companies. If you tell me we are going to save ourselves $400 billion over the next decade and it's only going to cost us $5 billion a year, that sounds like a win to me.

Obamacare is flawed - It has obvious problems. It is a massive overhaul of our healthcare system and it's going to have problems. It's going to cost us. Over time it's going to be fixed and improved. Too bad the Republican party won't take part in that.

That's fine, keep filing lawsuits.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Robbie

I saw on the news today that there are 20 different Republican proposals.

I haven't heard of one of them. Seriously. Post up some links!

Originally Posted by Robbie

This is all about a "legacy" for Pres. Obama and the Democrat Party.

I hate this term. Presidents should not be worried about their fucking "legacy". Their legacy should be working for the people, and should only be judged by history on their over all performance, not a single bill.

Originally Posted by Robbie

Shouldn't Pres. Obama and the Democrats who all voted "for the law before they read it" be the ones "Fixing" it?

They are, but they aren't getting any help. Lead, follow, or get out of the way. The Republicans aren't leading in this, they aren't following or helping, and they aren't getting in the way.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Do not question Brother Crockett Amelia G.

Doing so proves that you are racist and defending Republicans.

Stop resisting. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
Praise be to Lord Obama and the Collective.

Truthfully.... Amelia might just be the only rational one posting in this thread.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

How much does your health insurance cost?

$265 a month and prior to this I was paying about $86 a week which is almost $5k a year. Meaning Obamacare is saving me almost $2k a year.

I realize you might think some of my responses in this topic are harsh. However you will likely see these topics are the same thing over and over. If you pay attention, you will see that Robbie for instance can't stop telling everyone how biased they are and how unbiased he is. Yet if you watch what he does, you will never once see him pick apart any of his "conservative bros" arguments, he either just blindly accepts what ever they say or just ignores it as long as they go along with the I hate ACA and Obama.. Yet anyone that doesn't agree that ACA is shit or Obama sucks is just biased.

After having enough of my own topics turned into shitfests by these guys, I just troll them now because there is nothing to be gained by trying to have intelligent discussion with them. No one changes their minds and we all get called idiots by Vendillza and biased by Robbie with occasional guest visits by the likes of 12clicks or a random few here or there.. It's really just about amusement at this point as there is no real give or take.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Rochard

I don't spend my free time whacking off to Fox News or Republican sites. I haven't read much about this, but of course you are making a big deal about something that is minor. Your Republican based websites picked a number from the budget and made it sound horrible: "Obama to give insurance companies $5.5 Billion". Sounds horrible.

You are wrong, I didn't get the news from Fox, check the OP

I'm still waiting for an explanation on why Bush paid out a cool $1 billion to Filipino families who had family members that fought the Japanese during World War II.

You have a problem spending some money on the people that fought beside us in WW2 and you don't have a problem with giving over 5 times that to the people that got us in the mess of spending too much for insurance in the first place?

Obamacare is flawed - It has obvious problems. It is a massive overhaul of our healthcare system and it's going to have problems. It's going to cost us. Over time it's going to be fixed and improved. Too bad the Republican party won't take part in that.

That's fine, keep filing lawsuits.

But it's not an overhaul of the healthcare system, it's just making people pay more for insurance to that poor people pay less for insurance. This is not about the healthcare system, it's just about the money!

Originally Posted by Rochard

I haven't heard of one of them. Seriously. Post up some links!

Of course you haven't heard of them, you don't even read the posts on this page where I linked to one

They are, but they aren't getting any help. Lead, follow, or get out of the way. The Republicans aren't leading in this, they aren't following or helping, and they aren't getting in the way.

And what exactly are they doing, besides delaying parts that will make it worse before the mid term elections?

http://thehill.com/blogs/healthwatch...p-midterm-dems

Delaying the individual mandate so his lie about if you like your insurance you can keep it is softened before the elections, it will come in after that, purely a political move.








And I am still waiting to hear weather you lied about Sarah Palin's statement or just got it wrong, which is it, because she never said I can see Russia from my house. You said you knew that and it was a joke, so misquoting is now a sport? We're debating things here, posting shit that's wrong just makes you look like an asshole, so which is it?

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Truthfully.... Amelia might just be the only rational one posting in this thread.

Surely isn't you!

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by crockett

If you pay attention, you will see that Robbie for instance can't stop telling everyone how biased they are and how unbiased he is. Yet if you watch what he does, you will never once see him pick apart any of his "conservative bros" arguments, he either just blindly accepts what ever they say or just ignores it as long as they go along with the I hate ACA and Obama..

Yes Brother Crockett, you are right. I have seen the error of my ways.

I will now hate those "conservative bros". They are all racist and friends with George Bush.

I now see the light and realize that while the ACA might have a couple of small flaws (that will be fixed by MY President...Pres. Obama), it is overall a carefully and well constructed law that is 100% designed out of love for the American people.

Brother Ried and Sister Pelosi have nothing but our best interests at heart.
They want us all to be able to go to the doctor. How in the hell could the people who oppose ObamaCare be so heartless?

Yes Brother Crockett, Pres. Obama is going to straighten out the few little snafu's in ObamaCare and then everything is going to be great!

As Brother Tony said earlier...the NUMBER ONE problem in our country was healthcare costs!
Hell, we didn't even realize that in 2009! We all thought it was the economy and jobs.

Thank GOD for Pres. Obama's wisdom and vision.

And now that I have seen the light, I realize that with ObamaCare in place...nobody will ever have to worry about going to the doctor again and the economy is saved!

I will obey. I have been assimilated. Resistance is futile. Hail to Rachel Maddow.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

You are wrong, I didn't get the news from Fox, check the OP

Again, I don't spend my free time fapping off to sites bitching about Obamacare. In fact, Obamacare isn't even in the news these days.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

You have a problem spending some money on the people that fought beside us in WW2 and you don't have a problem with giving over 5 times that to the people that got us in the mess of spending too much for insurance in the first place?

In fact, I do have a problem paying people that "fought along side of us". They weren't fighting to defend the United States; They were fighting to win back the independence of their own country. How about their own government pays them for that, not us?

Again, we are spending $5 billion and saving hundreds of billions. Pretty easy decision here. You - and other people who follow politics - read way too much into all of this. This is my point - you can pick apart any budget any President has passed and say "Why did we pay $8 billion to train doctors?".

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

But it's not an overhaul of the healthcare system, it's just making people pay more for insurance to that poor people pay less for insurance. This is not about the healthcare system, it's just about the money!

We are going to pay more no matter what. Every year our healthcare costs go up. Like clockwork. At least this way healthcare costs have gone for some, myself included. Eventually the goal is to have everyone on healthcare so costs will stabilize.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

And what exactly are they doing, besides delaying parts that will make it worse before the mid term elections?

http://thehill.com/blogs/healthwatch...p-midterm-dems

Delaying the individual mandate so his lie about if you like your insurance you can keep it is softened before the elections, it will come in after that, purely a political move.

You seem to see "political trickery" here and I.... Just don't care. The Republican party seems to bitch a lot but doesn't seem interested in coming up with solutions. The are delaying certain aspects of the bill while they fix problems.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

And I am still waiting to hear weather you lied about Sarah Palin's statement or just got it wrong, which is it, because she never said I can see Russia from my house. You said you knew that and it was a joke, so misquoting is now a sport? We're debating things here, posting shit that's wrong just makes you look like an asshole, so which is it?

I didn't lie about her statement nor did I get it wrong; I was making a funny. "I can see Alaska from my backyard". That's fucking funny. That's not exactly what she said, but she seemed to imply she could "handle Russia" because "Russia is Alaska's neighbor" when the truth is she's never been to Russia.

This is the second time I've answered your question.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by crockett

$265 a month and prior to this I was paying about $86 a week which is almost $5k a year. Meaning Obamacare is saving me almost $2k a year.

Everyone I know personally has saved with Obamacare.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Everyone I know personally has saved with Obamacare.

Except the "convertible bros" of course they have all had to pay double!