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Old 07-12-2017, 10:06 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by celandina View Post
Not so, Russians need a strong hand, that is why he has over 80 % support at the polls. It is the idiots on both sides of the line ( the liberals and the conservatives ) who are blind to the reality of the world and still believe in some sort of Soviet hegemony of days past.

Just give the gander what is good for the goose and be done with that. Putin ( who is NOT a saint) may yet save the western world from a self destruction, you should appreciate his effort...
All propoganda.

Putin is a crook stealing from his own people there are Russian documentaries about this he's also taken rights away from gays and muted the press that speaks against him by imprisonment and murder because he's a dictator.

Russia needs a new leader, yes!
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:14 AM   #52
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Not so, Russians need a strong hand, that is why he has over 80 % support at the polls.
Suppose you also believed Saddam's approval rating was over 90% and received 100% of the vote.




Saddam scores 100% in leadership ballot
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:24 AM   #53
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It doesn't matter if you don't see a crime.. The FBI will see it as a crime, because it was.

I'll try to explain it assuming your being honest..


Russia was attempting to interfere with our democratic election process. They hacked the DNC & the RNC and who knows what else.

Now here comes Don Jr attempting to take info from the Russians for the sole purpose of affecting the outcome of the election. That is conspiring to commit election fraud. Just because they didn't get the info they wanted doesn't mean it's no big deal..

You steal someone's wallet only to find out there was no money still makes you a crook.


Don Jr, Kushner and Manafoprt all attempted to conspire with a foreign actor for the purpose of uncovering a suspected crime which would then have effect on the out come of the election.

They were required to pass this info to the FBI, not attempt to acquire it for personal/campaign gain.. Added to this Kushner went on to lie about this meeting on his security clearance form. This is a very big crime in and of it's self.. People have their security clearances revoked for simple shit as putting the wrong amount of debt on it. Yet here we have Kushner lying about meeting with a foreign agent trying to pass info on a political candidate to affect our election. That is a serious crime..

Also with out a fucking doubt this woman was a foreign agent. She was former Russian lawyer at the Kremlin or what ever her position was but she was claiming to be "brokering" info about criminal activity of a political candidate that was coming directly from the Kremlin and she was trying to get something in return. She was trying to affect official US govt policy.. She probably wasn't KGB or what ever the Russians call it but she was acting on behalf of the Russian govt..

Also I wanted to add.. you can't look at this meeting as a isolated event. It shows a pattern of willingness to collude with foreign agents and now add this on top of all the other issues Trump's campaign has sounding them with Russian involvement.

Before we saw there were players involved who had suspicious Russian contacts and almost all of them lied and tried to cover it up. Now we see them actually meeting and attempting to gain info which they were told was coming directly from the Kremlin. This is extremely damning information..

It's a very BIG SOMETHING Burger.. Fox News and Joushamo can claim all day it's nothing but they don't matter.. the FBI & the Special Counsel matter and this will matter greatly to them..


Also on the Kushner front we learned in the last day or two that he attempted to get a 500 million dollar load from Qatar. They wouldn't give it to him and now he was sitting on the presidents ear telling him to take a hard line against them and side with Saudi Arabia..

This is a major scandal in and of it's self but it was over shadowed by Trump Jr's dumbness..

Jared Kushner 'tried and failed to get a $500m loan from Qatar before pushing Trump to take hard line against country' | The Independent

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-advised-trump

Report: Kushner sought deal for $500M bailout from ex-Qatari prime minister - CBS News

This current admin and the people in it are dirty as fuck and they don't give a rats ass about making America great again. They want to enrich themselves..
^^^^ This

8 people at the top level of Trump's administration have been found lying about contact with Russian operatives. After each was first caught they said they met only once, then later all were found to have lied again and actually met with Russian operatives multiple times. These lies led to Jeff Sessions recusing himself, Flynn being fired, etc. These lies are a big deal. The people at the top of Trump's administration are lying for a reason, the are hiding something so damning that they're willing to be publicly fired than tell the truth publicly, and after Trump fired Flynn, he, to this day, says what a good man he his. This goes all the way to the top and it's quickly unraveling.

As was reported today , Manafort has started singing like a bird, this is how they found out about the meeting with Manafort, Kushner & Trump Jr. and this is how they knew about the emails, they were CC'd to Manafort by Trump Jr.
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:45 AM   #54
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About it saying only media and politicians for manipulation by own electorate.

Official Investigation going but results absolute fail.
Umm hello.. How can you say the official investigation is "fail" .. They haven't released their findings yet. This isn't Russia buddy boy.. Our media (aside from Fox news apparently) isn't the mouth piece of our govt or president.

What is in the media matters little to the investigation.. The media is simpl;y doing it's job to keep govt held accountable and release info to the public.. Media in the US job is not to speak the word of Trump.. Unlike RT in Russia who speaks directly what Putin tells them to speak.
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Old 07-12-2017, 11:33 AM   #55
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Umm hello.. How can you say the official investigation is "fail" .. They haven't released their findings yet. This isn't Russia buddy boy.. Our media (aside from Fox news apparently) isn't the mouth piece of our govt.
If they had something against Trump he would have been impeached. But now they have 0 result and to pull time and speculate on this.
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What is in the media matters little to the investigation.. The media is simpl;y doing it's job to keep govt held accountable and release info to the public.. Media in the US job is not to speak the word of Trump.. Unlike RT in Russia who speaks directly what Putin tells them to speak.
I am nothing say against media, lets they work.
And yes rt againe
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Old 07-12-2017, 12:16 PM   #56
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If they had something against Trump he would have been impeached. But now they have 0 result and to pull time and speculate on this.
No, it does not usually work that fast.

With Nixon, the FBI investigation of Watergate started in early 1972, the impeachment hearings didn't start until May 1974.

With Bill Clinton, Ken Starr was appointed as independent counsel to investigate Whitewater in 1994. Inpeachment proceedings did not start until 1998, so it took 4 years for that whole thing to go through the process.

We are at the beginning of the investigation into Trump, not the end.

Just imho, of course.

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Old 07-12-2017, 01:58 PM   #57
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No, it does not usually work that fast.

With Nixon, the FBI investigation of Watergate started in early 1972, the impeachment hearings didn't start until May 1974.

With Bill Clinton, Ken Starr was appointed as independent counsel to investigate Whitewater in 1994. Inpeachment proceedings did not start until 1998, so it took 4 years for that whole thing to go through the process.

We are at the beginning of the investigation into Trump, not the end.

Just imho, of course.

.
2-4 years, then it is normal situation, will be wait.
I am don't know what happened with Trump too
Interesting to see truth. but in media only blame and lie.
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Old 07-12-2017, 02:02 PM   #58
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All propoganda.

Putin is a crook stealing from his own people there are Russian documentaries about this he's also taken rights away from gays and muted the press that speaks against him by imprisonment and murder because he's a dictator.

Russia needs a new leader, yes!
When you cut wood some chips fly....here is a recent position on the gay issue:

Bruces Sketch - Monty Python's Flying Circus - YouTube

It is still valid today regardless of the PC....

So who would lead Russia ?? Another Yelcinite....no, Putin is the right guy for them
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Old 07-12-2017, 02:15 PM   #59
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Suppose you also believed Saddam's approval rating was over 90% and received 100% of the vote.




Saddam scores 100% in leadership ballot

If Saddam,Ghaddafi, Pahlavi,Musharraf and a few others were about today (and not betrayed by the "clintonites, bushes and now trumpeters") then the World would be at peace today.

So, I do believe that Putin is the last "great white hope"... Because the rest are pissing away the cultural traditions which are almost 2,000 years old.

I also hope that Assad will remain as the only real force fighting ISIS...( with the Kurds close second)... I am also a big fan of Duterte who is chasing ISIS out of Mindanao...

...and to all the leftists and the rightists who believe Russia is our enemy??? gfy

...and if you do not see my position, then weep later.
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Old 07-12-2017, 02:23 PM   #60
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...
So who would lead Russia ?? Another Yelcinite....no, Putin is the right guy for them
Medvedev was not so bad
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Old 07-12-2017, 02:25 PM   #61
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If Saddam,Ghaddafi, Pahlavi,Musharraf and a few others were about today (and not betrayed by the "clintonites, bushes and now trumpeters") then the World would be at peace today.

So, I do believe that Putin is the last "great white hope"... Because the rest are pissing away the cultural traditions which are almost 2,000 years old.

I also hope that Assad will remain as the only real force fighting ISIS...( with the Kurds close second)... I am also a big fan of Duterte who is chasing ISIS out of Mindanao...

...and to all the leftists and the rightists who believe Russia is our enemy??? gfy

...and if you do not see my position, then weep later.
Jesus Christ you fucking support Saddam, Ghaddafi, Duterte, Assad and Putin what the fuck talk about poor decisions making skills
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Old 07-12-2017, 03:23 PM   #62
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...and if you do not see my position, then weep later.
He is not
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:21 AM   #63
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Medvedev was not so bad
Of course not because he was to Putin what Ivanka is to Trump..." A good boy"
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:36 AM   #64
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:46 AM   #65
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Jesus Christ you fucking support Saddam, Ghaddafi, Duterte, Assad and Putin what the fuck talk about poor decisions making skills
Of course I do not, but I support the following wise men...



And



So, if you want to take chances with ISIS, Boko Haram, Taliban, Al-Queda, Al Shabab.... All created by us betraying our "sons of bitches" and us also treating enemies of our enemies NOT as our firends but also as our enemies, then you get into the shit the World is in now.

Who gives a fuck if Pahlavi knocked off a few "commies". Women could drive, study, marry and divorce ....the nation was wealthy, now you have 30 years of Ayatollah(s) and medieval times have arrived... Same could be said about Iraq, Afganistan, Lybia etc....and if you for one moment believe that Putin will allow the Jihhadists cross the Caucuses, you have a serious judgment issues, he will crack heads and so he should. It is now about the survival of the Western world.

Also the point I am making it is the Libs and Conservatives who drunk the same cool aid...so I cannot be acuused by either.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:24 PM   #66
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Of course not because he was to Putin what Ivanka is to Trump..." A good boy"
I don't think. He was like Bill and Hillary Clinton, but win in election of course
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:41 PM   #67
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It is now about the survival of the Western world.
No, just Hillary had lose election and now need to move hate from neighbors on someone in another side planet, it is more safety for USA
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Old 07-13-2017, 04:46 PM   #68
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imho, treason is a state of mind.
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Old 07-13-2017, 04:52 PM   #69
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imho, treason is a state of mind.
Luckily your opinion doesn't apply in a court of law.
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Old 07-13-2017, 04:54 PM   #70
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while we're at it, might be a good idea for most here to look up what the word globalist actually means as well.
A globalist is the opposite of a nationalist.

Since "globalism" is not a nation-state that will ever declare war on the US, it therefore follows that an anti-American pro-globalist will never be guilty of treason. Guess those legal eagles have been working overtime...
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Old 07-13-2017, 04:59 PM   #71
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Luckily your opinion doesn't apply in a court of law.
ffs, I wasn't putting it forward as a legal argument

It was more a social comment about how the prevailing culture does not punish or shame those who go against their own.
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Old 07-13-2017, 05:03 PM   #72
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Trump is doing the wrong thing and hooked his son & son in law into doing the wrong thing. Those two apples don't fall far from the tree. So much lying, so much deception and for what? To work with Russia, a foreign adversary, to throw the election in their favor.

The Republicans are getting what they wanted and the majority think everything is great. Unfortunate.
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Old 07-13-2017, 05:55 PM   #73
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I definitely DO NOT think it is ok.

BUT IT IS NOT TREASON.

Espionage, perhaps but not Treason.

.
Ok if you want to get all technical about it...then it's not treason.

and manslaughter is not murder. It's just killing someone.
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Old 07-13-2017, 06:12 PM   #74
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Ok if you want to get all technical about it...then it's not treason.

and manslaughter is not murder. It's just killing someone.
Yeah, too bad the legal system has to be all technical and shit.
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Old 07-13-2017, 06:38 PM   #75
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Ok if you want to get all technical about it...then it's not treason.

and manslaughter is not murder. It's just killing someone.


They don't care what the fuck he did, whether it legal or not, as long as he stays their president they're happy. If he gets charged for breaking the laws that he's broken they will be weird about it and come up with conspiracies and say "don't tread on me" and all that crap

Trump will have rallies everyday and get the audience angry as a show of the power of little hands.
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Old 07-14-2017, 09:00 AM   #76
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Trump is doing the wrong thing and hooked his son & son in law into doing the wrong thing. Those two apples don't fall far from the tree. So much lying, so much deception and for what? To work with Russia, a foreign adversary, to throw the election in their favor.

The Republicans are getting what they wanted and the majority think everything is great. Unfortunate.

Just get the fuck off the Russians ...they are NOT your enemies. They will save your ass as they did in the 40ties. They need another "great patriotic war" So, do not provoke them as both sides the libs and the conservatives are doing. Let the Jihhadist do it. Instead treat them as friends and they will protect you....You and me the members of the great but "decaying" civilisation.
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Old 07-14-2017, 09:07 AM   #77
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Ok, so you're one of those Trump supporters too embarrassed to admit it. That's not unheard of.

You know it's so obvious you're defending Donald Trump. I mean, you love him enough to go out of your way to look up the definition of treason and then copy and paste it to confirm that he's innocent and absolved of all crimes he's most likely committed. At least you would think he's guilty if you can add 2+ 2 and slide on a pair of pants without putting both legs in one side. The things even a half retarded monkey could figure out.
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Old 07-14-2017, 09:08 AM   #78
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Ok if you want to get all technical about it...then it's not treason.

and manslaughter is not murder. It's just killing someone.
omg!!! i think i broke a rib muther fuker
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Old 07-14-2017, 10:00 AM   #79
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Just get the fuck off the Russians ...they are NOT your enemies. They will save your ass as they did in the 40ties. They need another "great patriotic war" So, do not provoke them as both sides the libs and the conservatives are doing. Let the Jihhadist do it. Instead treat them as friends and they will protect you....You and me the members of the great but "decaying" civilisation.
We not need new wars))
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Old 07-14-2017, 01:17 PM   #80
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Just get the fuck off the Russians ...they are NOT your enemies. They will save your ass as they did in the 40ties. They need another "great patriotic war" So, do not provoke them as both sides the libs and the conservatives are doing. Let the Jihhadist do it. Instead treat them as friends and they will protect you....You and me the members of the great but "decaying" civilisation.
Only a Russian would say such idiotic bullshit. They are our enemies, they interfered in our election and they did not save our ass in the 40's. Go read a different history book.
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Old 07-14-2017, 02:39 PM   #81
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Only a Russian would say such idiotic bullshit. They are our enemies, they interfered in our election and they did not save our ass in the 40's. Go read a different history book.

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Old 07-15-2017, 01:09 PM   #82
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We not need new wars))
Of course not, we did not need one in 1914 or in 1939 but keep pissing off the big bear and he will kick back....and the EU, US and Canadian idiots are doing just that, instead on concentrating on the real enemy ...Jihadists.
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Old 07-15-2017, 01:22 PM   #83
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Of course not, we did not need one in 1914 or in 1939 but keep pissing off the big bear and he will kick back....and the EU, US and Canadian idiots are doing just that, instead on concentrating on the real enemy ...Jihadists.
Putin is the enemy.

Putin wants to break EU & American alliance because Putin is under sanctions for BREAKIBG his agreements over and over again and invading Crimea & bc Ukraine.

Russia needs a new leader that came keep his promises and let Ukraine & Crimea live in peace. Putin had his chance and he fucked everything up because if greed, corruption, and his addiction to toxic power.
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Old 07-15-2017, 01:28 PM   #84
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Only a Russian would say such idiotic bullshit. They are our enemies, they interfered in our election and they did not save our ass in the 40's. Go read a different history book.
Fuck your election, and if they did meddle so what it got them....? That freak who is now a president? Or the woman with hot flashes who hates Putin from the get go? There would have been NO difference in the outcome. America is in decline, yet idiots like you still believe in the might of the USA. Nobody else does.

USA entered the war in 1941, but did not land in Europe until 1944 ( 3 years later), Russia was attacekd also in 1941 but by 1944 they were near Warshaw....about 200 miles from Berlin....I will not argue who caused Nazis to collapse but Russians lost a lot more men then the Allies....histroy does not lie.
And they nuked the Japanese, by now they should have nuked Pyongyang, Racca and probably part of Lybia.

And as to if I am a Russian ? NO I do not like Russians, I am Canadian....but I believe in the old dictum "an enemy of my enemy is my friend...."...and that is why I will support anyone who does not want to make from Syria another Lybia or Iran. So smarty pants go and read a book on that.

...or go and weep
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Old 07-15-2017, 01:43 PM   #85
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Putin is the enemy.

Putin wants to break EU & American alliance because Putin is under sanctions for BREAKIBG his agreements over and over again and invading Crimea & bc Ukraine.

Russia needs a new leader that came keep his promises and let Ukraine & Crimea live in peace. Putin had his chance and he fucked everything up because if greed, corruption, and his addiction to toxic power.
Dumb and Dumber...UK, the Poles , the Czechs and as of today the Italians wants to break EU...( the Italians announcd today that they will give UN passports to 1/2 million refugees and send them North.) Putin just does not want another cold ( or hot) war...

The Crimea was Russian since Catherine the Great chased the Ottomans out of there, Ukraine has been Polish, Lithuanian and Russians ever since the medieveal times. It only become a nation 30 years ago . Wow what a history of a nation. Granted let them be a nation but do not usurb what is not yours.

And Putin? He is a " son of a bitch" but he is our great white hope...( I meant to say our son of a bitch)

It is all about what happens with a Western civilisation and Putin is the closest to those who is willing to defend it..


...just stop listening CNN and make a reasonable judgement based on historical facts.
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Old 07-15-2017, 02:01 PM   #86
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Fuck your election, and if they did meddle so what it got them....? That freak who is now a president? Or the woman with hot flashes who hates Putin from the get go? There would have been NO difference in the outcome. America is in decline, yet idiots like you still believe in the might of the USA. Nobody else does.

USA entered the war in 1941, but did not land in Europe until 1944 ( 3 years later), Russia was attacekd also in 1941 but by 1944 they were near Warshaw....about 200 miles from Berlin....I will not argue who caused Nazis to collapse but Russians lost a lot more men then the Allies....histroy does not lie.
And they nuked the Japanese, by now they should have nuked Pyongyang, Racca and probably part of Lybia.

And as to if I am a Russian ? NO I do not like Russians, I am Canadian....but I believe in the old dictum "an enemy of my enemy is my friend...."...and that is why I will support anyone who does not want to make from Syria another Lybia or Iran. So smarty pants go and read a book on that.

...or go and weep
Dearest Uninformed.

You're right, history does not lie. Now go learn some history and read about the US Lend-Lease and how America was supplying The Soviets with military and financial help that started in 1941. Without that you Russians would be speaking German right now.
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Old 07-15-2017, 02:03 PM   #87
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Of course not, we did not need one in 1914 or in 1939 but keep pissing off the big bear and he will kick back....and the EU, US and Canadian idiots are doing just that, instead of on concentrating on the real enemy ...Jihadists.
"Liberals" already marching

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Old 07-15-2017, 07:26 PM   #88
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Only a Russian would say such idiotic bullshit. They are our enemies, they interfered in our election and they did not save our ass in the 40's. Go read a different history book.
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Old 07-16-2017, 12:12 PM   #89
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Russia hacked "attacked" our election process and Trump's campaign conspired with them while they were attacking our election process, while purposely trying to change the outcome of our election.

This is most certainly treason if there ever has been..


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mildred_Gillars Axis Sally never waged war against the US but was convicted of treason for being part of the Nazi propaganda machine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iva_Toguri_D%27Aquino Tokyo Rose had the same fate but she was eventually pardoned.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Henry_Best Was a Nazi supporter, again part of the propaganda machine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_James_Monti defected to the SS worked as propaganda agent...

None of those people picked up arms and fought against the US, they all helped our enemies and ALL were convicted of treason.




We were at war with the countries they helped.

Same reason the Rosenbergs were tried for espionage, we were not at war with the USSR.
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Old 07-17-2017, 11:37 AM   #90
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Dearest Uninformed.

You're right, history does not lie. Now go learn some history and read about the US Lend-Lease and how America was supplying The Soviets with military and financial help that started in 1941. Without that you Russians would be speaking German right now.

I am well familiar with the land lease, it worked well then for the Free French,British,China and about 30 other countries and yes, it also partially included Russians. But where the similar deal did not work out was giving Stingray missiles to shoot down Soviet choppers and billions to the Taliban just to piss of the big Russian bear back in the 80thies. Well, this Reagan's "land lease" later supported by the Bushes did not work so well, and even Obama billions to the Syrian resistance ( read ISIS) resulted in 5 soldiers, yes that number is five soldiers.

...and since we are on the history lessons, who saved the Russians??It was non other then Hitler, who was stupid enough to declare war on the USA. USA in turn left Japan to play a "second fiddle" until Nazis were defeated.....and if this is a bit too complicated for the likes of you, the other party who helped Russians to defeat Hitler were the Serbs who "foolishly" refused to join Hitler's alliance. Hitler attacked them and had to postpone his Barbarossa attack for 30 days, and by that act Wehrmacht froze their asses at the gates of Moscow.

..I could go on but to the ignorant this means nothing, it is like feeding pearls to swine. So enjoy your little utopia until it bites you in the ass.
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Old 09-15-2017, 09:37 AM   #91
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A ISIS fighter, a US citizen, was captured this week ...
Another ISIS fighter, a US citizen, was captured last year but not convicted of treason --
American who allegedly fought for Islamic State surrenders in Syria, now in U.S. custody - LA Times

Made me think of this thread ...

WTF? heres why;
Treason Against the United States.
Published: January 25, 1861

Quote:
[T]he prisoners were brought by a writ of habeas corpus before the Supreme Court of the United States. In delivering the opinion of the Court, Chief-Justice MARSHALL said:

"To constitute that specific crime for which the prisoners now before the Court have been commuted, war must be actually levied against the United States. However flagitious may be the crime of conspiring to subvert by force the Government of our country, such ...
Treason Against the United States. - NYTimes.com
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Old 09-15-2017, 11:27 AM   #92
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At this point.... It doesn't matter if we call it treason or collusion or whatever. We have a full scale investigation.

We might have obstruction of justice. We might not.

Trump seems to think looking into his financials is a "line" that cannot be crossed. Not at all. An investigation looking to Trump's potential collusion with the Russians would not be an investigation at all; The first thing they will look at will be his finances. You always follow the money - Always.

God only knows what this will turn up. Anyone who says this is uncalled is plainly wrong. We investigated President Clinton with the White Water Investigation when there was little indication of any wrong doing, and in the end found no wrong doing. Instead, they charged him with lying under oath about a blow job and impeaching him, which I thought was horrible. So... Anything we find with Trump and all of his people will be fair game.

So far everyone involved has been lying about everything. Trump has surrounded himself with the worst people ever. You damn well know we'll find stuff.
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Old 09-15-2017, 04:15 PM   #93
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^^^ Well said
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Old 09-15-2017, 04:26 PM   #94
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I am glad you agree with yourselves.

Treason is the assembling men, and participating in, and actively making, armed conflict with the United States government --witnessed by the first account testimony of at least 2 men, under oath, in a court of law.

The penalty is death by hanging.
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