thommy

let me give you some thoughts about the 2008 crash:

as far as we kno, this crash was based on a huge number of depts what where risky (not unpaid - just risky)

that braught the banks in a situation that their assets lost on value because it WAS POSSIBLE that some of that loans would not be paid back.

so far so good - we all know that the countries (taxpaiyers) in the wold helped their banks
with trillions because they where in danger to lcrash all financial systems.

now i have a question: do you think that no government in this world would have someone
who would come on the following idea:

instead of giving money to the banks take over the guarantee for all this people who have loans with the effects that:

1. many of this "dangerous" loans would be paid back
2. the assets of the banks would not lose value
3. the real estate prices would not decrease

sound logic or not ?
and i am PRETTY sure that EVERY government in this world have at least ONE what had the same idea.

so why did it not happen?

i will tell you why:

that crash was a planned crash because the money people were able to buy real estate so much under the value that they made a win of 100ds or 1000 % on it a few years later.
since this crah the 1% richest in the world went 10 times richer as they have been before.

US government was never a president or some parliaments. it was ALWAYS the big capital. and you will not change that by let someone sit on the president´s chair who is (or want be) a part of this bilderberg group.

this bitch in the white house will sell you all because he has no moral, no wisdom and no humanity. he is just an easier lying puppet in the hands of the truly powerful of this world.
and he knows what he have to tell you that you see a red number black because he know that nobody will look deeper. and IF someone does he only have to call it "FAKE NEWS" and you guys are happy.

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Rochard

Yes, the economy was doing GREAT. Until the housing market collapsed in 2008. Then the economy was doing horrible.

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Rochard

What happened with the housing market was very, very simple.... The banks had it set up so that they couldn't lose. They would give a home loan to anyone. If they paid their mortgage, they made money. If they didn't pay their mortgage, the bank still made money, and then sold the house again and made yet even more money.

A friend of mine bought a house here in town and it was pretty obvious he couldn't afford it. He was barely making $40k, his wife was a "part time hair stylist". But the reality of it was it was much cheaper for him to "buy a house" because the mortgage was cheaper than paying rent, and once they couldn't afford it they could live in the house for another six months to a year before they were kicked out.

No matter what happened the banks always made money.

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Rochard

You are trying to say the economy was great, but it was the housing market that crashed and caused "instant wealth". Well, yes. We know exactly what caused the housing market. The years 2004, 2005, 2006 and 2007 were my best years too.... But no matter what, the economy crashed. What caused it was the housing market.

I understand what happened. I understood exactly what happened.

What I don't understand is when our unemployment started off at 12% and dropped to 4%, people were talking about how bad things are. We had 76 six months of continued growth but things were bad, and now we have a new President and on the 77th month everything is magically fixed?

Drumpf has not done a damn thing to the economy. Not. One. Damn. Thing.

Nothing at all has changed. This is the same exact pattern we've been seeing for years. But people like Baddog are like "Wow, the numbers are great". It's exactly the same numbers we saw in November but suddenly these numbers are great.

Where are all of the GFYers that want to argue about the "real unemployment rate"? LOL.

Here is my point Robbie.... We had a 4.6% unemployment rate at the end of Obama's term, but people said "Oh the economy is horrible". We have a 4.6% unemployment rate the first month of Trump's term and people are like "Oh my, Trump is going good". Nothing changed. Nothing at all changed. We are still running on Obama'a rule - the budgets and plans passed under Obama. This will continue for the next year too. Let's see what happens when Trump puts a new budget in place. Let's see where we stand two or four years from now.

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Relic

Stop trying to queer the pitch roochard.

Bladewire

Trumps executive order last week removed the regulations that Obama placed on the banks & lenders to avoid another crash and protect our investments & bank accounts.

If you get a "change of terms" or "policy update. Email/snail mail from your investments accounts etc. be wary & read the fine print.

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Robbie

Bladewire...the regs went too far is what Trump is saying and business owners agree.
It restricts too much capital.
You have to think about this intelligently like a boss.
Of course followers want to be coddled like children.
Leaders don't want or need that shit.

You have to ask yourself...are you a leader or a follower?

The leaders in the biz world are thinking one way.
Snowflakes think the other way.

I literally can't wrap my mind around why you or Richard would ever be in lockstep with that kind of philosophy.

GFED

Inflation > GDP = BAD

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Rochard

The leaders in business are the ones that fucked us. They don't care about what is good for the economy, but instead want what is good for business. These are not the same things. They set things up so that the banks could not lose, which is what caused the crash. Now they are removing all of those protections.

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Rochard

I missed this last part when I replied.

No, I am not in lockstep with this kind philosophy. Trump has put the people directly responsible for the crash in charge of our economy. That's like putting all of the criminals in charge of our legal system.

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Robbie

The people directly responsible for the crash was the FEDERAL GOVT.

Specifically CONGRESS in the late 1990's.

I don't think that Trump has any of those people in his cabinet. And as far as being "in charge of our economy"...can you please be more specific?

You see...you're not thinking clearly on this. You are all emotional about it.

Which person "in charge of our economy" is the one who was "directly responsible for the crash" in your mind?

The answer is "nobody".

There is no one person "in charge of our economy" Rochard. The economy is driven by business and jobs. The govt. can either create an environment that is conducive to GROWTH or it can restrain growth via taxation and regulation.

But putting that aside....the legislation that was passed by Congress in the late 1990's and signed by President Clinton was what was "directly responsible for the crash".

Can you please point out to me one member of Trump's cabinet who was a member of Congress in the late 1990's and sponsored that legislation?

No, you can't. Because that is a false narrative that you are being fed.
That's what I meant when I proposed that you are sharing the "snowflake" philosophy instead of business leaders philosophy.

Remember brother...there are two kinds of people in this world: Winners and losers.
I think you are meant to be a winner. That's why I can't understand your positioning with a line of thinking that is put forward by a political party that is dedicated to a big nanny-state govt. that restricts ambition and wealth.

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shiraz9944

What are you talking about, the jobs report crushed what they predicted, WAY more jobs created and unemployment is at 4.5%. Which means nothing, it's underemployment that matters since if you aren't actively looking for a job you aren't counted in the unemployment number.

shiraz9944

If you count the people that gave up looking for a job or took a shitty fast food job, unemployment is in the high teens. Look around people, you really believe 96% of the country has a job right now?

JohnnyClips - BANNED FOR LIFE

Trump is off to a fantasytic start

Bladewire

Trump believes 96% of people have jobs, after saying last month he thought the real number was 50%, so if Trump was a non believer, but now believes, he must be right and did his homework.

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I've never seen so much traffic in my fucking life on a normal weekday mid day

thommy

in this special case it is not true.

look USA is the country with the highest debt in the world and the big advantage on this is that most of this depts are in US-dollar and not in foreign currency.

a high inflation, low dollar value and zero interest politic would be the one and only chance for the US to get rid of the debts within 100 years. but to get rid of ALL debts is not nessecary if trump would understand and accept the global trade market.

but this is not what he is working on obviously because he is doing EVERYTHING wrong at this part. so for my opinion, he has one of the 2 strategies in mind (or both):

1. crash the stock market when it is on high, get his commission from those people who will participate from it

then run away and leave the shit behind or

2. starts WW3 because he thinks that can help the US-industry same as WW2 did.
in that case, he forgot in what time we live and never heard the words of einstein who said: I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.

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Barry-xlovecam

The financial position of the United States includes assets of at least $269.6 trillion (1576% of GDP) and debts of $145.8 trillion (852% of GDP) to produce a net worth of at least $123.8 trillion (723% of GDP) [a] as of Q1 2014.
Financial position of the United States - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financ..._United_States

JohnnyClips - BANNED FOR LIFE

Trump already making america great again and pissing off the shitlibs

thommy

you should touch your head (if you have one) - you are wet already!!!

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Rochard

I say nay nay!

I'm sorry, the people directly responsible for the crash was the banks, period. Oh, maybe the federal government helped by passing a few laws, but it was the banks who put the system into place and they are the ones that benefited from it.

And now they are in charge of our government.

Putting business people in charge of our government is horrible. They see things from a business viewpoint, not a political one. Flynn was a perfect example. They ignored warnings from the ethics department, failed to properly vet him, and had to remove him from office. Seriously - how could they not know he was an agent of a foreign government who had collected over a half a million dollars from Turkey? Wouldn't that have been the first question you would ask him?

Rex Tillerson is next. The entire State Department is idle right now with nothing to do, no marching orders from Tillerson or the White House. The White House doesn't trust it's own State Department, and Tillerson seems to be on the outside of Trump's circle. The Mexican Foreign Minister visited the US, and Tillerson had no clue he was in the US no less what to do about it. Trump is taking meetings without any direction from the State Department. Now Tillerson is taking his first trip without the press.

And what the fuck is Carson running HUD?

This is going to end up in disaster.

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thommy

the problem was that there have not been rules.
banks wasn´t forced to keep reserves - banks could speculate even over their own value.

but even the "value" they seemed to have was not existing because they gave foul credits to activate them as assets.

then they lend with this "assets" more money to specualte with til someone found out that this assets do not have ANY value.

as the US banks sold this "asstes" to the whole fucking world, every bank in the planet (except the muslim banks) have been sitting on mountains of worthless paper.
no bank trusted the other anymore - nobody lend capital to the other and that caused the crash were ALL asstes (even the ones what where paid) run in the celler.

real estate lost value and with this value even healthy companies with own real estate what they has a guarantee for their own credits went into trouble because of the decreasing values of their real estate assets their loans became also under pressure because the guarantee wasn´t enough.

obama tried to do something agains that but with the republican opposition he just was able to make a "mini-law" with a quite small protection - "Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act" was made to prevent criminal practices of financial product marketers with their customers and the other important part was to secure that in a new crisis taxpayers do NOT have to pay for the damage again.

trump eliminated the dodd franc act with a decree - what shows everybody with open eyes where he sees his preferences.

he will fuck USA again and the idiots will be the small people, because the rich ones will be safe with the lower company taxes he has announced also.

this is SUCH A VERY clear strategy what we can see here - and that is not only my meaning that is the meaning of every serious FREE !!! economic scientiest in the world.
everybody who tells something else is bought and already a paid adviser of this handful of big guys what will go laughing out of this next crisis

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Robbie

If you believe that and don't understand the role that the Congress played in the 1990's...then yes, you are going to have the belief you have.

But you're 100% wrong on that.

The evil banks are almost totally controlled by U.S. Govt. regulations. And the regulations that Congress passed and Pres. Bill Clinton signed into law dictated how they operated.
It was literally ILLEGAL for a bank to turn down those mortgages that ended up going underwater in 2008.

Understand?
An EVIL bank never forced one single person to come in and try to live the American Dream by owning their own home.

That was strictly people making their own decisions.

And it all appeared to be working pretty damn good for a lot of years.

Rochard, I know you think that politicians are some kind of geniuses who can do no wrong...but they don't necessarily know shit about shit.
The Feds have fucked up more than they have gotten correct over the last 2 century's.

And those lifetime politicians in D.C. couldn't foresee what was going to happen down the line.
Yes, there were a few people who predicted a major crash...but those people are wrong as often as they are right as well.

I don't think it was Congress' "Fault", and I don't think it was Pres. Clinton's "Fault". And I damn sure don't think it was Bush's "Fault".

It was nobody's "fault".
Did some people make bank when it all came down? Hell yes they did. Do you blame them?

I don't.
When an opportunity arises you grab it.

Remember Rahm Emanuel? He was President Obama's Chief Of Staff and earlier in his career he was Pres. Clinton chief political advisor.
He famously said: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste."

Anyway...I think you need to kick back and reflect on your line of reasoning. I believe it's built on a fallacy: an incorrect understanding of what caused the housing market crash.

And if you still don't "believe" it and have some kind of weird "belief" that the "banks did it" and Trump is hiring the banks or however you are thinking it works...then we'll just have to drop the whole thing.

If we both don't understand what happened in the first place and agree there...how can we extrapolate any discussion on what's happening now?

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ClaudiaMarie.Com

GFED

Alan Greenspan

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