Seattle?s $15 Min. Wage Is Making Something Happen That City Leaders Never Expected - Page 3 - GoFuckYourself.com

arock10 · 03-26-2015, 05:27 AM

Low minimum wages (below the cost of living) simply allow corporations to get their employees incomes subsidized by the government. Then who do you think are helping pay these wages? The tax payer aka us
So when a McDonald's or walmart pays $7 an hour, it's us picking up the difference instead of a multi billion dollar company just paying living wages

So for profit businesses are the ones abusing the tax payer and the government. Sorry that people have been blinded by conservative propaganda talking shit against the min wage. Which by the why when accounting for inflation peaked in the 1970s at over $10 in today's dollars.

arock10 · 03-26-2015, 05:29 AM

And Kane mostly just beat me to it

MaDalton · 03-26-2015, 05:31 AM

one fulltime job at 40 hrs/week should pay enough to secure a living above welfare level

if your business relies on paying your employees below that and you have the rest of the tax payers substitute that by having to pay your employees food stamps or whatever, then you need to figure out how to be better or close.

and I do have employees, they earn about 3 times the minimum wage in this country

Magnetron · 03-26-2015, 06:45 AM

It's all adapt or die until someone's McWhopper goes up 25 cents.

Grapesoda · 03-26-2015, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaDalton

one fulltime job at 40 hrs/week should pay enough to secure a living above welfare level

if your business relies on paying your employees below that and you have the rest of the tax payers substitute that by having to pay your employees food stamps or whatever, then you need to figure out how to be better or close.

and I do have employees, they earn about 3 times the minimum wage in this country

when I was 18 I started working with a construction company.... I was earning top pay as a heavy equipment operator... running a scrapper, make $3.75 per hour, same as all the other guys... (we did works 60-80 hours a week though) that was in 1973... those guys are the last guys to work a job and support a stay at home wife, family and buy a home.... minim wage was $1.45... pretty much 1/2 top scale I guess... what happened? 'Arab oil crises'

Rochard · 03-26-2015, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kane

The idea in the article was that if a company makes a 22% profit margin they may only make a 19-20% profit margin after paying higher wages.

There would still be profit, just not as much as before.

No restaurant makes a 22% profit margin. Ever.

crockett · 03-26-2015, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaDalton

one fulltime job at 40 hrs/week should pay enough to secure a living above welfare level

if your business relies on paying your employees below that and you have the rest of the tax payers substitute that by having to pay your employees food stamps or whatever, then you need to figure out how to be better or close.

and I do have employees, they earn about 3 times the minimum wage in this country

This is my thinking as well. Certain groups love to talk about govt leeches, but the truth of the reality is, any company whom purposely keeps workers as "part time" in order to get out of paying their obligations as an employer or much worse paying people at such a low wage the govt has to supplement their employees. Well that company is the true govt leech.

Walmart and most fast food is perfect example of govt leech business model.

MaDalton · 03-26-2015, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

No restaurant makes a 22% profit margin. Ever.

McDonalds is not far off

McDonald's Profit Margin (Quarterly) (MCD)

they could for sure afford paying their people more

Axeman · 03-26-2015, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arock10

Low minimum wages (below the cost of living) simply allow corporations to get their employees incomes subsidized by the government. Then who do you think are helping pay these wages? The tax payer aka us
So when a McDonald's or walmart pays $7 an hour, it's us picking up the difference instead of a multi billion dollar company just paying living wages

So for profit businesses are the ones abusing the tax payer and the government. Sorry that people have been blinded by conservative propaganda talking shit against the min wage. Which by the why when accounting for inflation peaked in the 1970s at over $10 in today's dollars.

One could argue it is the government's willingness to hand out these subsidies to employees as being the problem. Allows these people to never work harder to be great employees and increase their worth to their current or next employers who value their skills. Doesn't make them accountable to survive. Lets them get by doing the bare minimum, with the least responsibility.

I would argue the safety net has gotten too big, too vast, and too easy to make people complacent and lazy.

dyna mo · 03-26-2015, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

No restaurant makes a 22% profit margin. Ever.

you couldn't be more wrong.

dyna mo · 03-26-2015, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Due

I have done so before, it was profitable but taking away time from other ventures that was more profitable. Sure I could have kept it running and have 2 half ass ventures or hired someone and loose the profit but keep the risks..
you need to look at what your own time is worth and invest it wisely

that's not at all the same thing and certainly not what the article is trying to portray. The article claims the owners shuttered their businesses, closed them and walked away from their investment because of a pending accounting issue. didn't even try to sell them. that's not savvy in the slightest. and that's because the article is misleading. the business owners didn't do that.

dyna mo · 03-26-2015, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

you guys make it sound like there is something to "figure out"... you will magically "figure out" how to increase your sales by lets say 30% next month to cover the additional expenses?

in many businesses if things are not quite working right, you are LOSING $$ each month... not making less, but actually have to pull money out of your saving account to piss away, with little hope of ever getting it back...

so imagine you worked out the numbers and unless sales increase by 30% next month you will be out of $20k...

What solution do you propose for a business owner in that position?

how can i provide solutions to a bullshit problem? the article was misleading. they didn't shutter their businesses due to impending pay problems.

and yes, in most business roadblocks, stumbling points, etc, there is plenty to figure out. that's what running a business is. figuring shit out.

woj · 03-26-2015, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaDalton

one fulltime job at 40 hrs/week should pay enough to secure a living above welfare level

if your business relies on paying your employees below that and you have the rest of the tax payers substitute that by having to pay your employees food stamps or whatever, then you need to figure out how to be better or close.

and I do have employees, they earn about 3 times the minimum wage in this country

Welfare level is defined by the government at about $1000/month, which translates to $6.25/hr... which is way less than the current minimum wage, and that makes $15/hr about 2.5 of the "welfare level"...

so the whole argument: "no one working full time should live in poverty" is complete bullshit...

MaDalton · 03-26-2015, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

Welfare level is defined by the government at about $1000/month, which translates to $6.25/hr... which is way less than the current minimum wage, and that makes $15/hr about 2.5 of the "welfare level"...

so the whole argument: "no one working full time should live in poverty" is complete bullshit...

where exactly is the minimum wage $15/h right now? I must have missed when this became law

and i'll leave the "complete bullshit" comment to you - as far as i know you don't have employees

arock10 · 03-26-2015, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crockett

This is my thinking as well. Certain groups love to talk about govt leeches, but the truth of the reality is, any company whom purposely keeps workers as "part time" in order to get out of paying their obligations as an employer or much worse paying people at such a low wage the govt has to supplement their employees. Well that company is the true govt leech.

Walmart and most fast food is perfect example of govt leech business model.

socialism is bad unless its for multi billion dollar companies!

woj · 03-26-2015, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaDalton

where exactly is the minimum wage $15/h right now? I must have missed when this became law

and i'll leave the "complete bullshit" comment to you - as far as i know you don't have employees

it's not now, but it will be soon in Seattle (whole point of this thread), making it 2.5x level of "welfare level"...

how can someone working full time live below poverty line? minimum wage is 7.25 so that translates to about $1100 per month... which is ABOVE welfare level...

so where is the problem?

MaDalton · 03-26-2015, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

it's not now, but it will be soon in Seattle (whole point of this thread), making it 2.5x level of "welfare level"...

how can someone working full time live below poverty line? minimum wage is 7.25 so that translates to about $1100 per month... which is ABOVE welfare level...

so where is the problem?

i was going to write an answer and then i thought of an old polish proverb: "not my circus, not my monkeys"

dyna mo · 03-26-2015, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaDalton

i was going to write an answer and then i thought of an old polish proverb: "not my circus, not my monkeys"

90% of your posts are you starting an argument then bailing out.

Magnetron · 03-26-2015, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

it's not now, but it will be soon in Seattle (whole point of this thread), making it 2.5x level of "welfare level"...

how can someone working full time live below poverty line? minimum wage is 7.25 so that translates to about $1100 per month... which is ABOVE welfare level...

so where is the problem?

You are overlooking that the poverty level is adjusted based on how many individuals are living in a household.

2015 Poverty Guidelines

It would be a different story if everyone was single without kids and could rent a room above a one car garage like Fonzi.

MaDalton is simply saying there would be less welfare if the average employee was better compensated rather than just paying them the bare minimum allowed by law.

Magnetron · 03-26-2015, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaDalton

i was going to write an answer and then i thought of an old polish proverb: "not my circus, not my monkeys"

MaDalton · 03-26-2015, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyna mo

90% of your posts are you starting an argument then bailing out.

that is true - i am working on not even starting an argument

SuckOnThis · 03-26-2015, 12:26 PM

woj · 03-26-2015, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

and what's wrong with that? the person on the receiving end should then get a flash in his mind: "maybe I don't have any skills? maybe I should get my shit together and acquire some skills so employers would be willing to pay me more than minimum wage?"

then 2 seconds later: "fuck that, I'll just complain... I will rally politicians to raise the minimum wage to $15 and all my problems will be solved..."

crockett · 03-26-2015, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

and what's wrong with that? the person on the receiving end should then get a flash in his mind: "maybe I don't have any skills? maybe I should get my shit together and acquire some skills so employers would be willing to pay me more than minimum wage?"

then 2 seconds later: "fuck that, I'll just complain... I will rally politicians to raise the minimum wage to $15 and all my problems will be solved..."

You mean like nunchuck or computer hacking skills?

kane · 03-26-2015, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axeman

One could argue it is the government's willingness to hand out these subsidies to employees as being the problem. Allows these people to never work harder to be great employees and increase their worth to their current or next employers who value their skills. Doesn't make them accountable to survive. Lets them get by doing the bare minimum, with the least responsibility.

I would argue the safety net has gotten too big, too vast, and too easy to make people complacent and lazy.

I agree. There are some people who will do the bare minimum so long as they can continue to get their welfare and live their lives.

If there was no welfare or it was very difficult to get on I would bet that wages would increase one way or another. People would either demand higher wages because they can't otherwise survive on them or there would be more unionization and through it an increase in wages.

If people have no safety net then tend to demand more and work a little harder.

RandyRandy · 03-26-2015, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

No restaurant makes a 22% profit margin. Ever.

kane · 03-26-2015, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magnetron

You are overlooking that the poverty level is adjusted based on how many individuals are living in a household.

2015 Poverty Guidelines

It would be a different story if everyone was single without kids and could rent a room above a one car garage like Fonzi.

MaDalton is simply saying there would be less welfare if the average employee was better compensated rather than just paying them the bare minimum allowed by law.

Also many programs have different qualifiers. You might be able to be at say 133% of the poverty level and still qualify for the program

kane · 03-26-2015, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

No restaurant makes a 22% profit margin. Ever.

According to Bloomberg Taco Bell sits at about 20%. It's not 22%, but it is pretty close.

Grapesoda · 03-26-2015, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaDalton

McDonalds is not far off

McDonald's Profit Margin (Quarterly) (MCD)

they could for sure afford paying their people more

Ma, mc donalds is not a restaurant...don't confuse corporate earnings with individual franchises.... completely different ball games...

03-26-2015, 05:27 AM	#101
arock10 Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,218	Low minimum wages (below the cost of living) simply allow corporations to get their employees incomes subsidized by the government. Then who do you think are helping pay these wages? The tax payer aka us So when a McDonald's or walmart pays $7 an hour, it's us picking up the difference instead of a multi billion dollar company just paying living wages So for profit businesses are the ones abusing the tax payer and the government. Sorry that people have been blinded by conservative propaganda talking shit against the min wage. Which by the why when accounting for inflation peaked in the 1970s at over $10 in today's dollars. __________________ Sup

03-26-2015, 05:29 AM	#102
arock10 Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,218	And Kane mostly just beat me to it __________________ Sup

03-26-2015, 05:31 AM	#103
MaDalton I am Amazing Content! Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Cheque Republic Posts: 39,781	one fulltime job at 40 hrs/week should pay enough to secure a living above welfare level if your business relies on paying your employees below that and you have the rest of the tax payers substitute that by having to pay your employees food stamps or whatever, then you need to figure out how to be better or close. and I do have employees, they earn about 3 times the minimum wage in this country __________________ AmazingContent.com - providing only the best content and service since 2003 Monetize your content on Veegaz.com - one of Germanies largest VOD sites Skype: madalton02826 - Email: oltecconsult [at] gmail [dot] com

03-26-2015, 06:45 AM	#104
Magnetron Lord High Groundhog Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Bumblefuck, USA Posts: 1,841	It's all adapt or die until someone's McWhopper goes up 25 cents. __________________ . Approach the mirrored reflection saying his name three times : "Butcher .... Butcher .... Butcher ....." and wait to see if this Bogeyman urban legend manifests in the background, looming over shoulder While your neighbors were busy killing off everyone in the neighborhood with your own butcher knife in hand concealed behind your back you stood for ever before the window saying nothing

03-26-2015, 12:26 PM	#122
SuckOnThis So Fucking Banned Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: In my head Posts: 6,844