Welcome to the GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum forums.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Post New Thread Reply

Register GFY Rules Calendar Mark Forums Read
Go Back   GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum > >
Discuss what's fucking going on, and which programs are best and worst. One-time "program" announcements from "established" webmasters are allowed.

 
Thread Tools
Old 04-30-2012, 05:37 PM   #1
Brujah
Beer Money Baron
 
Brujah's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: brujah / gmail
Posts: 22,157
PHP Refugees

What language did you move to?
__________________
Brujah is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 05:38 PM   #2
Klen
 
Klen's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Little Vienna
Posts: 32,234
You mean from PHP to or to PHP from ?
__________________
For GFY administration inquiries- email info at gfy.com or send PM.
For advertising inquiries - email marketing at gfy.com

Inquiries which are not related to administration or advertising on GFY wont be processed.
Klen is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 05:39 PM   #3
AdultKing
Raise Your Weapon
 
AdultKing's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Outback Australia
Posts: 15,602
I'm rather fond of Python these days, but most of our stuff is PHP.
AdultKing is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 05:53 PM   #4
Babaganoosh
♥♥♥ Likes Hugs ♥♥♥
 
Babaganoosh's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: /home
Posts: 15,841
I've been doing less and less PHP over the last couple of years. Most of my backend stuff is Perl and my new frontend stuff is Pyton/Django.
__________________
I like pie.
Babaganoosh is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 05:59 PM   #5
videoscribe
Banned by fatfoo
 
videoscribe's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 362
PHP is a very popular script. A lot of people sure use it on the internet. Many traffic trading scripts are PHP.
__________________
Banned by fatfoo
videoscribe is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 07:19 PM   #6
FetishWeb
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 390
Quote:
Originally Posted by videoscribe View Post
PHP is a very popular script. A lot of people sure use it on the internet.

wow, sounds great! where can I buy PHP ?
FetishWeb is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 07:26 PM   #7
raymor
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,745
It looks like PHP 6.0 might not suck. Still, PHP 5.0 sucks enough that we do most things in Perl if not C. The Perl 6.0 design is awesome, but we'll se if it's ever released.
raymor is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 07:43 PM   #8
AdultKing
Raise Your Weapon
 
AdultKing's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Outback Australia
Posts: 15,602
I do like this quote:

"“Recalling the exact syntax for the built-in stab() function, you make a sane assumption and call shoot(GUN, FOOT); The foot shoots your gun.”

— Some user who calls theirself “plams” on the Something Awful Forums"
AdultKing is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 07:55 PM   #9
brentbacardi
Confirmed User
 
brentbacardi's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,425
Why does pHp suck? Just curious... I know it because most shit out there is php so its good to know...
__________________
Go Fuck Yourself!
brentbacardi is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 08:04 PM   #10
react
Confirmed User
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NZ
Posts: 673
ruby/rails.
__________________
--
react
react is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 08:39 PM   #11
shake
frc
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Bitcoin wallet
Posts: 4,663
Moving to python myself. So much more powerful, and not that hard to learn coming from PHP.

Although I'll keep using PHP as well most likely, as it works well for simpler projects.
shake is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 08:53 PM   #12
baryl
Confirmed User
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,086
Quote:
Originally Posted by videoscribe View Post
PHP is a very popular script. A lot of people sure use it on the internet. Many traffic trading scripts are PHP.
This guy's a spammer btw. Should go hang out in the Q&A forum with the rest of the spammers trying to pick off new people.

Last edited by baryl; 04-30-2012 at 08:54 PM..
baryl is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 09:00 PM   #13
brentbacardi
Confirmed User
 
brentbacardi's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,425
Quote:
Originally Posted by baryl View Post
This guy's a spammer btw. Should go hang out in the Q&A forum with the rest of the spammers trying to pick off new people.
Its Fatfoo reincarnated!

Hmm I think you may be too new to GFY to know that though?
__________________
Go Fuck Yourself!

Last edited by brentbacardi; 04-30-2012 at 09:01 PM.. Reason: Saw your join date...
brentbacardi is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 09:05 PM   #14
barcodes
Confirmed User
 
barcodes's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Florida
Posts: 2,040
Use PHP and ColdFusion.
I prefer coldfusion but php is more popular withblogs, commerce, etc.
There is a custom tag where you can mix the two together which would be cool.
barcodes is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 10:20 PM   #15
Brujah
Beer Money Baron
 
Brujah's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: brujah / gmail
Posts: 22,157
Was picking up some Ruby skills (not Rails), and enjoyed it. Going to get familiar with Python.
__________________
Brujah is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 01:51 AM   #16
AdultKing
Raise Your Weapon
 
AdultKing's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Outback Australia
Posts: 15,602
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brujah View Post
Was picking up some Ruby skills (not Rails), and enjoyed it. Going to get familiar with Python.
Ruby is great, Ruby on Rails is great but its a language that seems to get in the way of what I'm wanting to achieve. Maybe I haven't put enough time into it.

I love Python, the Django framework is great , applications are superfast to develop.

However most of our stuff is written in PHP simply for legacy reasons, there's no good reason to go and rewrite everything in another language so we don't.
AdultKing is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 05:38 AM   #17
Klen
 
Klen's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Little Vienna
Posts: 32,234
Well if i would have to use other language then it would be java.
__________________
For GFY administration inquiries- email info at gfy.com or send PM.
For advertising inquiries - email marketing at gfy.com

Inquiries which are not related to administration or advertising on GFY wont be processed.
Klen is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 05:38 AM   #18
Klen
 
Klen's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Little Vienna
Posts: 32,234
Quote:
Originally Posted by raymor View Post
It looks like PHP 6.0 might not suck. Still, PHP 5.0 sucks enough that we do most things in Perl if not C. The Perl 6.0 design is awesome, but we'll se if it's ever released.
Depend what you want to do,in some cases php can do what perl cant.
__________________
For GFY administration inquiries- email info at gfy.com or send PM.
For advertising inquiries - email marketing at gfy.com

Inquiries which are not related to administration or advertising on GFY wont be processed.
Klen is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 05:50 AM   #19
u-Bob
there's no $$$ in porn
 
u-Bob's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq: 195./568.-230 (btw: not getting offline msgs)
Posts: 33,063
Perl. learned perl long before php and while I do use php for certain things, 90% of what I do, I do in perl.
u-Bob is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 05:53 AM   #20
Babaganoosh
♥♥♥ Likes Hugs ♥♥♥
 
Babaganoosh's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: /home
Posts: 15,841
Quote:
Originally Posted by KlenTelaris View Post
Depend what you want to do,in some cases php can do what perl cant.
Like what?
__________________
I like pie.
Babaganoosh is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 05:56 AM   #21
u-Bob
there's no $$$ in porn
 
u-Bob's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq: 195./568.-230 (btw: not getting offline msgs)
Posts: 33,063
Quote:
Originally Posted by Babaganoosh View Post
Like what?
curious about that myself.
u-Bob is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 06:03 AM   #22
mafia_man
Confirmed User
 
mafia_man's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq#: 639544261
Posts: 1,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by react View Post
ruby/rails.
Yup, because I like Rails more than Django.
__________________
I'm out.
mafia_man is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 06:10 AM   #23
mafia_man
Confirmed User
 
mafia_man's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq#: 639544261
Posts: 1,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdultKing View Post
Ruby is great, Ruby on Rails is great but its a language that seems to get in the way of what I'm wanting to achieve. Maybe I haven't put enough time into it.
That's kind of a strange point. Ruby and Python are really similar, major differences being indentation and blocks etc. Also, Rails and Django are pretty similar too.

I like Rails more than Django because the template system (ERB) is cleaner and Ruby gems makes development easier. Django has an admin but I'm usually doing maintenance in a terminal.

When I do Python web development these days I'll use Web2Py.
__________________
I'm out.
mafia_man is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 06:23 AM   #24
AdultKing
Raise Your Weapon
 
AdultKing's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Outback Australia
Posts: 15,602
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafia_man View Post
That's kind of a strange point. Ruby and Python are really similar, major differences being indentation and blocks etc. Also, Rails and Django are pretty similar too.
I started with Python quite a while ago, I guess I've grown along with the Python way of doing things.
AdultKing is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 07:35 AM   #25
Klen
 
Klen's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Little Vienna
Posts: 32,234
Quote:
Originally Posted by Babaganoosh View Post
Like what?
I'l need to dig my code database to give you answer,not much examples but i do know there was something just cant remember exactly what was it.
__________________
For GFY administration inquiries- email info at gfy.com or send PM.
For advertising inquiries - email marketing at gfy.com

Inquiries which are not related to administration or advertising on GFY wont be processed.
Klen is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 07:48 AM   #26
raymor
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by KlenTelaris View Post
Depend what you want to do,in some cases php can do what perl cant.
I'd put a bet on that. I wouldn't be at all suprised if there was something you know how to do in PHP and you don't know how to do in Perl.

There are some things that PHP can do with four different functions that all do the same thing, do_it(), DoIt(), itDoto(), and it.do(), which Perl just uses one operator for.
__________________
For historical display only. This information is not current:
support@bettercgi.com ICQ 7208627
Strongbox - The next generation in site security
Throttlebox - The next generation in bandwidth control
Clonebox - Backup and disaster recovery on steroids
raymor is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 08:56 AM   #27
raymor
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by brentbacardi View Post
Why does pHp suck? Just curious... I know it because most shit out there is php so its good to know...

There's WHY it sucks, and HOW it sucks. For HOW it sucks, Google will bring up a million good pages. As to WHY it sucks, it sucks because it was never supposed to be a programming language from the beginning. It was designed as a blog/templating system, written in Perl. It wasn't designed as a good programming language because it wasn't designed as a programming language at all.

When people starting using it as if it were a programming language, they started adding programming-like functions, but skipped the design step. That resulted in things like cat_walk() and dog_walk(), but personWalk(). ( Perl would just have walk(). )

An exerpt from the PHP documentation is illustrative:
Quote:
I don?t see the point, especially for something like PHP where most of the scripts will be rather simple and in most cases written by non-programmers who want a language with a basic logical syntax that doesn?t have too high a learning curve.
Lerdorf was trying to make a simplified system for non-programmers to create non-programs, without having to learn much if anything. He suceeded, big time. Thousands of non-programmers create all kinds of stuff in PHP without learning anything first. That's great for them. The only problem is some people BUY these piles of PHP written by the clueless, thinking they are getting actual software. They then expose this non-program written by non-programmers publicly on the web, a delight to all the crackers. Oops.
__________________
For historical display only. This information is not current:
support@bettercgi.com ICQ 7208627
Strongbox - The next generation in site security
Throttlebox - The next generation in bandwidth control
Clonebox - Backup and disaster recovery on steroids
raymor is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 10:43 AM   #28
Dejan
Confirmed User
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 8,776
PHP with jquery works just fine...
Dejan is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 12:07 PM   #29
ravo
Confirmed User
 
ravo's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Skype: ravo.fpctraffic
Posts: 5,417
perl, FTW.

Oh, and I'm loving using jquery for front-end stuff.
__________________
AdultAdBroker - Buy and Sell Your Flat Rate Banners, Links, Tabs, Pops, Email Clicks and Members' Area Traffic - updated March 2024
ravo is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 12:17 PM   #30
d-null
. . .
 
d-null's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 13,724
d-null is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 12:22 PM   #31
u-Bob
there's no $$$ in porn
 
u-Bob's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq: 195./568.-230 (btw: not getting offline msgs)
Posts: 33,063
Quote:
Originally Posted by d-null View Post
perl you learn because you want to get the job done no matter what the job is.
u-Bob is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 01:13 PM   #32
mafia_man
Confirmed User
 
mafia_man's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq#: 639544261
Posts: 1,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by ravo View Post
perl, FTW.

Oh, and I'm loving using jquery for front-end stuff.
The thing about jQuery is that it should be built straight into the DOM.
__________________
I'm out.
mafia_man is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 01:26 PM   #33
Klen
 
Klen's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Little Vienna
Posts: 32,234
Quote:
Originally Posted by u-Bob View Post
perl you learn because you want to get the job done no matter what the job is.
Actually,when i encounter something on php what i cant do,then i call perl or other language script over exec .So no need to fully code in perl
__________________
For GFY administration inquiries- email info at gfy.com or send PM.
For advertising inquiries - email marketing at gfy.com

Inquiries which are not related to administration or advertising on GFY wont be processed.
Klen is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 01:28 PM   #34
asdasd
So Fucking Banned
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,225
Compiled EMCA.
asdasd is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 08:08 PM   #35
brentbacardi
Confirmed User
 
brentbacardi's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,425
well I only know html, css and php all self taught mind you and I build some cool ass shit! so blah... thinking about ruby/rails though but its not on w3schools and their shit is soooo easy to follow.
__________________
Go Fuck Yourself!
brentbacardi is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 08:38 PM   #36
Brujah
Beer Money Baron
 
Brujah's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: brujah / gmail
Posts: 22,157
Quote:
Originally Posted by brentbacardi View Post
well I only know html, css and php all self taught mind you and I build some cool ass shit! so blah... thinking about ruby/rails though but its not on w3schools and their shit is soooo easy to follow.
This was fun to go through.
http://railsforzombies.org/
__________________
Brujah is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 09:10 PM   #37
rowan
Too lazy to set a custom title
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 17,373
I still use PHP for the majority of my websites, although I've recently started using C for non realtime / backend stuff.

Over the past few months I recoded an application that needed 400 different PHP processes consuming a total of about 2GB of RAM, into a single internally threaded C app that consumes <100MB. Internet bandwidth is now the limiting factor, rather than RAM and CPU utilisation.
rowan is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 09:28 PM   #38
brentbacardi
Confirmed User
 
brentbacardi's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,425
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brujah View Post
This was fun to go through.
http://railsforzombies.org/
Should I learn rails or ruby first? how does that work?
__________________
Go Fuck Yourself!
brentbacardi is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 09:57 PM   #39
Babaganoosh
♥♥♥ Likes Hugs ♥♥♥
 
Babaganoosh's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: /home
Posts: 15,841
Quote:
Originally Posted by brentbacardi View Post
Should I learn rails or ruby first? how does that work?
Rails is a Ruby framework. You should know at least some Ruby before diving into a Ruby framework.
__________________
I like pie.
Babaganoosh is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 10:06 PM   #40
Brujah
Beer Money Baron
 
Brujah's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: brujah / gmail
Posts: 22,157
Quote:
Originally Posted by brentbacardi View Post
Should I learn rails or ruby first? how does that work?
It's been awhile but if I remember you pickup some ruby skills with that before it does anything with rails. I might be confusing it with something else.
__________________
Brujah is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 10:30 PM   #41
raymor
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,745
I really respect people who learn new skills. Learning complex subjects like computer science takes a lot of dedication, so I do respect those who say:

Quote:
Originally Posted by A lot of people
well I only know html, css and php all self taught mind you and I build some cool ass shit! so blah..
Not to pick on anyone in particular, but the number of people saying "all I know is PHP and I've no actual training in computer science, but go ahead and trust your sever to my guesses" is one reason PHP a) has a reputation as a language people write bad software in and b) caters to non-programmers.

It's awesome when people learn a bit of PHP so they can solve simple problems for themselves. It's bad when those people pretend to be qualified software engineers and sell really crappy software for complex systems to others.

Last edited by raymor; 05-01-2012 at 10:32 PM..
raymor is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 02:22 AM   #42
V_RocKs
Damn Right I Kiss Ass!
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Cowtown, USA
Posts: 32,298
People who go to school will always rag on those who don't... Don't hate...
V_RocKs is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 06:04 AM   #43
mafia_man
Confirmed User
 
mafia_man's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq#: 639544261
Posts: 1,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by brentbacardi View Post
Should I learn rails or ruby first? how does that work?
Read through this first:

http://ruby.learncodethehardway.org/book/
__________________
I'm out.
mafia_man is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 06:33 AM   #44
raymor
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by V_RocKs View Post
People who go to school will always rag on those who don't... Don't hate...
Some extremely capable people didn't have much schooling. Although I have piles of comp sci and security related textbooks around here, my schooling was actually in law, not comp.sci or security. I'm not putting down people without formal schooling.

What I am saying is simply that PHP has allowed a lot of people to do a little scripting and the web and adult in particular doesn't always distinguish between people who picked up some PHP vs qualified software engineers. To design software well, you almost have to have experience with at least one high level language and one low level. To design scalable software, you need to know systems. Database architecture is a science itself, which includes relational algebra and calculus as subcomponents. If you're self taught, cool. I'm largely self taught in that I read the books and I speak with the experts independent of any college class. The books I read include the works of Codd and Date because in order to use relational databases PROFESSIONALLY, you need to understand relational algebra. To design them correctly, you need to know relational calculus. How you learn it doesn't matter, but these things make the difference between a professional and an amateur.

PHP reminds me of Lego. Like PHP, Lego is easy and you can build cool stuff with Lego, without knowing much about mechanical engineering. Just don't confuse a Lego device with a professionally fabricated item.
__________________
For historical display only. This information is not current:
support&#64;bettercgi.com ICQ 7208627
Strongbox - The next generation in site security
Throttlebox - The next generation in bandwidth control
Clonebox - Backup and disaster recovery on steroids
raymor is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 09:52 AM   #45
Why
MFBA
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: PNW
Posts: 7,230
i like how people who know "low level" stuff always try to rip on php coders. how many of the web's largest sites are written in pure C, or Perl, rather then PHP. how many of the most used web apps are written in php? wordpress, drupal, joomla, this forum, nats, flickr... the list is endless, so much of whats on the web most people use all day is in PHP. i believe LAMP is landing more hits a day and servicing more requests then any other stack out there.

PHP is a perfectly fine language as long as you learn to secure it properly and optimize it. I remember a day when Perl was considered easy and lots of people wrote really bad form mailer scripts they picked up on the web somewhere... this led to trillions of unsolicited emails due to poor security. ;)

@raymor, i agree that high end math skills help, when you are writing code for companies like google. most web companies do not require such skills, lets be realistic. as for php having multiple ways to do things... i dont really see that as an issue.

i think these arguments go both ways... its not he bike, its the rider.

to each his own, i like PHP, Perl and shell script, but I believe they all have their own place.
Why is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 11:47 AM   #46
mafia_man
Confirmed User
 
mafia_man's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: icq#: 639544261
Posts: 1,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by Why View Post
i like how people who know "low level" stuff always try to rip on php coders. how many of the web's largest sites are written in pure C, or Perl, rather then PHP. how many of the most used web apps are written in php? wordpress, drupal, joomla, this forum, nats, flickr... the list is endless, so much of whats on the web most people use all day is in PHP. i believe LAMP is landing more hits a day and servicing more requests then any other stack out there.

PHP is a perfectly fine language as long as you learn to secure it properly and optimize it. I remember a day when Perl was considered easy and lots of people wrote really bad form mailer scripts they picked up on the web somewhere... this led to trillions of unsolicited emails due to poor security. ;)

@raymor, i agree that high end math skills help, when you are writing code for companies like google. most web companies do not require such skills, lets be realistic. as for php having multiple ways to do things... i dont really see that as an issue.

i think these arguments go both ways... its not he bike, its the rider.

to each his own, i like PHP, Perl and shell script, but I believe they all have their own place.
Quoted for the truth!

There's nothing wrong with PHP (well I'm not a big fan of $ and -> syntax) but there's everything wrong with the programmers who use it.

PHP is far too easy to start using. <?php and ?> in a .php file and through it on a server, run it, that's it.

Django and Rails on the other hand are much harder to use. Sure there are build a blog in 5 mins screencasts, but deploying those in a production environment isn't as simple as uploading the files to the server.

Finally, the internet is polluted with awful PHP tutorials and snippets that allow SQL injection and XSS. Not that you can't do that in Rails and Django.
__________________
I'm out.
mafia_man is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 12:34 PM   #47
V_RocKs
Damn Right I Kiss Ass!
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Cowtown, USA
Posts: 32,298
Quote:
Originally Posted by raymor View Post

PHP reminds me of Lego. Like PHP, Lego is easy and you can build cool stuff with Lego, without knowing much about mechanical engineering. Just don't confuse a Lego device with a professionally fabricated item.
Perfect analogy. Put legos into the hands of somebody that understands things on a larger scale and they will build you something truly amazing. Put them into less capable hands and they will build you something that works...
V_RocKs is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 03:09 PM   #48
2012
So Fucking What
 
2012's Avatar
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 17,189
__________________
best host: Webair | best sponsor: Kink | best coder: 688218966 | Go Fuck Yourself
2012 is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 03:13 PM   #49
Theo
HAL 9000
 
Industry Role:
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 34,524
Quote:
Originally Posted by Why View Post
i like how people who know "low level" stuff always try to rip on php coders. how many of the web's largest sites are written in pure C, or Perl, rather then PHP. how many of the most used web apps are written in php? wordpress, drupal, joomla, this forum, nats, flickr... the list is endless, so much of whats on the web most people use all day is in PHP. i believe LAMP is landing more hits a day and servicing more requests then any other stack out there.
so true, PHP took over
Theo is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 03:32 PM   #50
raymor
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by Why View Post
i like how people who know "low level" stuff always try to rip on php coders. how many of the web's largest sites are written in pure C, or Perl, rather then PHP. how many of the most used web apps are written in php? wordpress, drupal, joomla, this forum, nats, flickr... the list is endless, so much of whats on the web most people use all day is in PHP. i believe LAMP is landing more hits a day and servicing more requests then any other stack out there.

PHP is a perfectly fine language as long as you learn to secure it properly and optimize it. I remember a day when Perl was considered easy and lots of people wrote really bad form mailer scripts they picked up on the web somewhere... this led to trillions of unsolicited emails due to poor security. ;)

@raymor, i agree that high end math skills help, when you are writing code for companies like google. most web companies do not require such skills, lets be realistic. as for php having multiple ways to do things... i dont really see that as an issue.

i think these arguments go both ways... its not he bike, its the rider.

to each his own, i like PHP, Perl and shell script, but I believe they all have their own place.

As far as low level versus high level, I said a professional programer should know at least one high level language and one low level. The big sites that use PHP use PHP written by programmers who understand what it's doing at a low level. That is, they could translate the PHP to C, they picture what the C or assembler would look like, and therefore know WHY some algorithms are good and others bad. For example, I have a function in a very high level language - a rewrite rule in .htaccess. I know that rule only calls the stat() system call, and I know what stat() does in assembly, so I know it's fast. I write efficient .htaccess by understanding how that's translated to assembler. If I had no experience in C or assembler, my .htaccess wouldn't be nearly as efficient.

Regarding high level math, a relational database management system such as MySQL is a calculator for doing relational algebra. That's all MySQL is - a calculator. If you have no understanding of what relational algebra is, you won't be very good at doing relational algebra using MySQL. How many PHP scripters don't know that MySQL in a RDMS? If you don't even know what it IS, how well are you going to design schemas for it? Not well at all, obviously. MySQL is a tool for managing relational databases, but many scripts create things in MySQL that are not in fact re relational databases, so the scripts suck and break in various ways. Trying to design a MySQL database without knowing what a relational database IS is like designing a CMS without knowing what a web site is.
__________________
For historical display only. This information is not current:
support&#64;bettercgi.com ICQ 7208627
Strongbox - The next generation in site security
Throttlebox - The next generation in bandwidth control
Clonebox - Backup and disaster recovery on steroids
raymor is offline   Share thread on Digg Share thread on Twitter Share thread on Reddit Share thread on Facebook Reply With Quote
Post New Thread Reply
Go Back   GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum > >

Bookmarks
Thread Tools



Advertising inquiries - marketing at gfy dot com

Contact Admin - Advertise - GFY Rules - Top

©2000-, AI Media Network Inc



Powered by vBulletin
Copyright © 2000- Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.